MTFCA Forum

Allan, but aren't they almost always RHD cars? If so, that would be covered when I draw all the RHD's.

Slight oversight....Mag Post P/N.

Seems pretty simple whatever it is, that one piece on the far right with the broken nub on it is the switch handle. It looks to screw onto the back of that large plate with the 2 prongs and 3 springs on it. That small disk is fits onto the the cylinder (barrel) with the 2 prongs on it, that's the ke...

1915HogsHeadAssembly.jpg So far as I know (and I could be wrong), only the 1915 had ribbed pedals, all those preceding them had lettered pedals and all those after 1915 had smooth pedals, so 1915 is sort of an odd man out. Sort of like my early 22, it has some things on it that are unique to early ...

Well, turns out that not only those gussets on the 13-14 weren't the only thing that was different from the 11-12's. 11-12 also had a different Clutch Lever Shaft (3402) it was longer and had 2 woodruff key slots in the bottom of the shaft, the Clutch arms were also different in that they were held ...

Allan, I'm gonna need some good pictures of RHD versions of the Hogshead, got any?

Allan, that's the way I've got them shown, the round part of the key goes into the bottom of the shaft, the square flat part goes into the hole in the bottom of the arm....just the length of that groove is what I don't know, so I made it so it could be slid on or off from either side of the arm. 191...

Allan after some research, I found those keys and pictures of the shaft too, they are woodruff keys (3408), 2 of them slotted into the bottom of the shaft (3402) which is longer than the one I had originally drawn too, since it sticks through to the other side of the hogshead housing. The flats of t...

Allan, you're correct, when I plotted out the location of these screws on the arms, the holes don't come anywhere close to the shaft, sooo, no grooves then. That would mean that this key, is below the pinch bolt under the shaft. It's the only place with enough meat on it to allow for such a thing, u...

Allan, you are correct that they are a "pinch bolt" type. What I'm wondering is, do you think that the shaft that the forks are held to is slotted so that the bolt acts like a key to keep the forks in alignment? Because I don't find any mention of any kind of a key on those forks anywhere. And I've ...

Chis, they're a family owned business, sooo, if somebody gets sick, the whole bloody shop gets it too. There is also a really good chance that they're not open just now also because of all this Covid nonsense. But their stuff is really nice, the back tack rail and backrest in my touring were made by...

1913-1914, the hogshead housing is slightly different, in that it has corner reinforcing gussets on the 4 corners of the domed part of the housing. Otherwise everything is exactly the same as it was in 1911-1912.

I'd use these folks, they've been in business for well over 50 years now and their stuff fits, whereas some of the parts sold from vendors don't, without a lot of fitting.

http://fordwood.com/

1911-1912HogsHeadAssembly.jpg You'll notice that there is only one pedal on this assembly, because it is the only pedal that is captive to the Hogshead. The other two would be added later when the bands are there to secure them, otherwise they sort of get in the way of trying to seat the Hogshead. ...

GG Gregory....do you have a picture of the other side of this timer?

Thanks Jeff, this is exactly what I needed to know, good pictures too. I see what Allan was saying about the adjusters being on the outside for the brake and reverse and the Hi/Lo being on the inside of the Hogshead (just the opposite of the domestic cars).

Stan I appreciate your offer of sending them to me, but what with the way the mail is these days and how very rare these are, I'd feel terrible if something were to go missing or something because we're preparing to move out of state...all I really need are very clear and concise pictures and you've...

Stan, that first one is a very interesting looking timer, do you know how very tempting your photo's are? What's more they're laid out nicely too, so I can see lots of detail...you've given me everything I need to draw these. Rare are they? Damn, I'm just itching to draw this too, lol. That timer, l...

Allan What sorts of differences and do you have any pictures of RHD Hogsheads? And do you know if there were ever any early car RHD 2 levers? I've sort of started amidships on these, 1911-1912, 1913-14, 1915 (15 is sort of an oddball), 1916 and 1917-1918...not sure if there is any differences betwee...

Chris, Oh, jeees I wish I had seen this earlier (I was expecting a call, not a post, sorry).

I live in So, Cal, so it doesn't get too bloody cold here...usually, but as I recall the flash point of the soluble oil I'm using is 354ºF and it's pour point is -6ºC, and yes I mix it with water. I've never had any problems with it, cooling or otherwise, my car doesn't ever steam, nor gurgle when d...

The only thing I would add, is try soluble oil instead of coolant....coolant is made to reduce heat in pressurized cooling systems (like in modern cars). Nothing on a Model T or TT for that matter is pressurized other than the tires. Soluble Oil is made to reduce heat in non-pressurized cooling syst...

Dan, Much appreciated, these are great (especially that last one, very clear as to what is going on). By the look of that linkage, it works like the brake lever in later cars, kicking the Hi/Lo pedal into neutral, I noticed it also has another arm on it that works the reverse band but uses a lever i...

Congratulations and thanks for all you've done helping to get the San Fernando Chapter back up and running. But then this bloody Covid thingy hit and now we're all sitting round wondering what sort of mischief we can get into with our cars. I've found that it is best if you find something to do quic...

Does anybody have any pictures of a completely disassembled Hogs Heads (and I mean the Model T Parts, not some bloody pigs head), that is without pedals and or any of the other parts on or in it? Any and all of them I'd like to have pictures of and what I need is front, right side, rear and undernea...

The ball was not brazed to the tube according to Johnny Guitar, but threaded. However the rear flange was though and it is not made out of the tubes material, it is a separate piece brazed or welded onto the tube. The driveshaft on my 22 has those rivets and it also has a braze/weld joint on the tub...

Ok, did some checking on friends cars and found what you were talking about...sort of. The rear flange isn't made from the torque tube, it is a forged flange that is welded to the tube and the bead ground flush with torque tube. 26DriveshaftSpoolFlangeEnd.jpg This is George Clipner's 1926 Touring, I...

Yeah come to think on it some I think you're right, those flutes were for tightening nuts and lock wire.

Knew I missed something.

Please look this over and let me know if I've missed anything....sometimes even I get lost in itty bitty lines,

.

I don't know Steve, I just tired to go through their check out and they tacked on the vat anyway, even after giving them my home address and country...I think they mean to charge that along with shipping. Do you know if they have a stateside distributor?

Allan, I just went and looked at those Blockeys on their site, £149.00 ($194.39) sounds fine. but add onto that the bloody vat (Value Added Tax) and it's £178.80 ($233.36)...I suppose if they wear well, that would be worth it. The tires I've got currently are Canadian Goodyear's and been on my car s...

You can do what I did in my 22 touring, I took (bound/tied) 2 inches out of the bottom of the back rest springs. This allows your bottom to sit further back making more leg room, yet not making it less comfortable to drive long distances in....worked for me and I'm 6'5".

Steve, you running Wards Riverside? Been thinking of those also...my Canadian Goodyear's are about shot (only been on the car for 40 years), time to look for a new set of wheel skins. I like the price of the Wards (not so much where they're made though) as opposed to the other prepro brands, I mean ...

Nice find, but wouldn't that screw mess up the threads on that bolt your drilling for the cotter pin? I mean to secure it you'd have to clamp it down quite a bit wouldn't you? Me I don't like cotter pins, I prefer vibration proof nuts...not period, but they work far better than cotter pins do...and ...

I don't know if "Super Mario" was the owner or not, but the sign on the back of the Center Door says it's "In Transit"....sooo, maybe it's being delivered to somebody on that street?

Reconfiguration on the ball.

Slight reconfiguration of the ball.

Alan, how's this?

I think this may be the what this looks.....

Slight change to spool and thrust bearing.

Slight Change to spool and thrust bearing and bushing sleeve.

Ok, Is this correct Vern? ColorCrossSection1914-1921 Driveshaft.jpg All of those bushings I've seen have that slot in them, I even asked the question of Lang's as to what it was for, the response was "to clear the woodruff key", which is why I'm showing it. Do you know if Ford's original bushing had...

Vern, on my drawing you see a space between the back of the gear and the sleeve...that space is actually the woodruff key slot that's in the sleeve, for the sleeve to fit tightly against the back of the pinion gear, that slot has to be there to accommodate the woodruff key. I had assumed that the sl...

Larry, probably so, but I'm rather limited upon what I can use for that research, even so, my work is basically given as "in progress" state. Meaning I will continually change them until I either stumble upon (whether by design or accidentally) the correct representation, so any help anybody can giv...

Ok, did a little checking and it seems I got quite a bit wrong...sooo, how's this one? The thing I'm not sure of is the length of the hardened inner race 2596, in that does it extend past the hyatt bearing to include the thrust bearing or not...seems to me it should, but then I really don't know. Co...

Ok, how about this? The illustration also had to change slightly because of what you said, the flange on the fitting would have to thicker and the woodruff key was too small also. 1909-2-Piece-Driveshaft.jpg Came to find out that the flange of the bushing housing of the pinion side was set inside a ...

Ok, another change, gonna have to make this slight change through all the drawings though, has to do with the woodruff key, I had it a bit too small.

You running a Kingston L-4? Never hurts to rebuild the carburetor, if for no other reason than to eliminate one problem area, but it sounds to me that there is something definitely wrong if your carb is puffing out vapor all around it (an L-4 doesn't have that many places to "puff" from). And I'm no...

Allan I completely forgot about that, not sure what the depth is though...is the correct?

1913 was the last of the 2 piece driveshafts, and in 1914 the ball and radius rod connection are one piece, this allows the bushing to move further forward to between the radius rod mounting lugs. This places the bushings support nearer to the U-Joint. Also worth mentioning is the U-joint pin plugs ...

Ok, NOW is when that hardened sleeve 2596 replaces the hardened step in the driveshaft. This sleeve design continues through 1927.

Slight change, had to change the lock screw 2586 (a bit too short).

ColorCrossSection1910-1911-2-Piece-Driveshaft.jpg The hardened sleeve 2596 didn't appear until 1911 with the tapered end driveshaft, where the pinion gear is held by a nut and cotter pin, instead of the pin rivet arrangement. The Driveshaft has a hardened end step that the roller bearing 2890 ran o...

More corrections as to that rivet I was asking about (still don't have a part number for it, but I now know what it looks like...sort of, lol). 1909-2-Piece-Driveshaft.jpg Also notice that the word "Early" has been removed, since this type of pinion arrangement ended late in 1910. 1910-1911-2-Piece-...

Slight change, the rivet isn't like the normal rivet at the end, it is through the collar on the back of the pinion gear into the shaft.

Ok, seems to be a few corrections here, first off; Richard, you're correct it is one big rivet, however since I don't really know (nor seen any examples of it) what it looks like, I'm using the generic form of a rivet here. If anybody has any picture of that end with the pinion gear installed please...

Anti-Freeze, does diddly squat in non-pressurized engine (like the Model T), since it is designed for exclusive use in pressurized cooling systems, like in modern cars. What it does do (besides being a class 3 pollutant) is keep rust build up down and keep the engines cooling system from freezing in...

Might be, I don't know myself, but that would be cheaper than a couple of small ones though and Henry always went with cheaper.

Do you happen to know what this rivet looks like? I can't find any examples of it in any of the books I've got.

Sometimes with illustration you can't see things as clearly as you can in a cross section. This is a 1/4 cross section showing both the outside and the inside of the 1909 driveshaft assembly. I've got a few questions though...on the part 2535, it shows in the Ford parts book as one assembly (bushing...

Larry, that's exactly WHY I do post to the forum. My research is limited, you guys know a hell of a lot more than I do, sooooooo, I post here, so you and everyone else can help to make them correct.

What size is that thing? And what point sizes are the fonts? I can tell you why it didn't look right with any of the engraving machines....the fonts were hand laid, not computer generated. For them to look like the original, you'd have to do it exactly the way they did it...hand lay it. If you want ...

Small change

The reason for this change was because to show the differences between the 1918 and 1919, I'd need to draw a completely new drawing for those small plugs that cover the pin holes for the U-Joint. Just didn't think it was worth it...so I made a notation instead.

Yes there is two, one is already installed (the top one) because it wouldn't be clear with the ball mounting ring in the way. I suppose I could back the mounting ring off a bit so as to show that plug though...

How about this?

LOL, You're right Allen, there would be no need for that since there isn't a sleeve on this assembly...I forgot to remove it.

Taken care of.

Thanks!

Cross Sections of all years for comparison.

Not sure of the year, but shouldn't matter if your car is late 22 - 25, this should be correct.

: OneManTouringTop.jpg (23.73 KiB) Viewed 1794 times

None of this matter, there are whole clubs of folks driving High Wheeler's, you know true Horseless Carriages and they usually can't even break 25 mph. If some folks think your a moving road hazard....they can go around.

Steve, I'll bet, you probably noticed when that chunk of stuff came off your coils that they weren't wrapped with any of this high faluting electronic Mylar tape...for one thing it wasn't around back then and for another, it would've been too expensive to Henry to even think about using. Nope, Ford ...

Mine wasn't on the car, it was on the windshield.... ArtFor18thAmendmentOriginal.jpg Unfortunately, my wife dropped the original glass it was on and it broke. Fortunately it only broke in 3 places so..... ArtFor18thAmendment.jpg I reproduced it. Problem is, I don't agree with the 18th Amendment, it ...

I prefer these guys, might be a bit more pricey, but their durability and ease of use (nothing special, you put your switch to dim the lights are dim, put them to bright and the lights are bright), without any modifications to your car. http://www.logolites.com/products/led-headlights/ They can also...

Lisa, you're correct about Gary, he's not on-line, really, but he does have a tablet I think (a recent purchase I believe), whether he knows how to use it or not, is anybodies guess. Phoning Gary is fruitless, unless you call around 2 pm and then you're more likely to get his machine than him, but t...

Ok, just to get things clear.... 1909-2-Piece-Driveshaft.jpg Early 1909 2 piece Drive Shaft with babbit bushing bearings and fixed pinion gear. 1910-1911-2-Piece-Driveshaft.jpg 1910-1911 2 piece Drive Shaft still with fixed (riveted) pinion gear, but with Hyatt roller bearing, spool and loose ball b...

Lisa, I remember Richard announcing your inquiry, I would've loved meeting up with, but Gary is who Richard assigned. Gary is no slouch when it comes to all things T, he's very knowledgeable and has kept that old 1915 of his he affectionately names "Patina" (fancy word for rust) going and drives it ...

Lisa I'm a member of the San Fernando Valley Chapter...this Covid nonsense has put a kibosh on things a bit, but we're still here and just last month Gary Hendrickson, Richard Arroyo and myself went and looked at a new fellows 23 Runabout. But, we're still here, you can't expect the founding chapter...

Steve, that's a Derrick Pang thing, he does that everywhere there is tunnel no matter how long it is, hell, he'll even do an over pass. The only time I mash down on the old hand klaxon is where some bonehead does something stupid in front or to either side of me....then he gets the " belay/shear off...

Stan...does it have some other designation other than 1909, Kingston 5 ball? Anything different about it other than the air intake?

Lisa, You're going to Long Beach? Long drive, did that too myself for a while until I found that the San Fernando Valley Chapter was still in existence (and a hell of a lot closer too). I drive my car out to Long Beach for their Swap Meet. Didn't need the freeway at all, just took Sepulveda Blvd the...

And this would be 1910-1911, this is where the change from the babbit bushings to the bearing spool was made (probably really showed up in late 1909, but as we all know that is really 1910's starting date).

Ok Dan, so this is the Early 1909 Drive Shaft Assembly....

Ok, was wondering about that....also made some changes to the bearing, seems the one I've got shown is a later style for 22-27. 1911-1913-2-Piece-Driveshaft-1-B.jpg At this time it is supposed to be independent balls and cup that holds them and an outer race (that looks for the world like a hardened...

Ok.....

Allen do you have a picture of one of these things? I think I know what you're talking about...it's like a relief cut on the flange, right?

Like this?

You mean the one I carelessly didn't put a part number on? That holds the ball to the 4th main cup? You could be right, been so long since I've been down and under, but I think on my 22 there is one there, as I recall there are two of them, one inside between the 4th and the engine and one outside b...

Same goes for this one, you find something amiss here let me know and I'll change it!

Don't know if I've got this right or not, but I thought I'd post it here and see. Maybe you folks could tell me what I've got wrong better with a picture than with my writing, I can get a might verbose (as Steve Jelf can tell you), and pictures cut 1000 words down to maybe these few. :lol: 1909-1910...

You know those little tab ears that you bend over the shafts? I didn't see any real need for them. When I did mine, they broke and I installed my new Stainless ones anyway, punched swedged the ends a bit and then shove them back in the column housing. They're held in 3 places anyway, so you probably...

Let it set in the garage and get dusty. DustyCar2.jpg DustyCar.jpg Actually it is sawdust, from having to replace the bottom board under my kitchen sink, which made sort of a mess in my garage. And my poor car caught the worst of it. If it weren't so bloody hot out there I'd take her out and wash an...

Mine had that problem too, but on more places than yours (and because of the problems that led to me taking the damned thing out, I had to fix it too), I just mixed up some potting epoxy and applied liberal coats to the exposed coils. Then then painted them with that spray-on red electric varnish yo...

Stephen, was this babbit bearing cast into the spool? or were there 2 of them and pressed in for both sides? How was it lubricated (babbit requires lubrication)? Was there a grease cup on top where the locating plug/pin is now, or an oiler? Or did they rely upon the differential juice to splash up a...

I'm sure it's been mentioned here already, but just buy a new one! You'll have a lot less problems with it than you're likely to have repairing that old one.

Ok, silly me I thought that there were only 2 variations of the drive shaft (ha,ha,ha) every time I get to thinking something is going to be breeze, I get pulled up short with a wrinkle....or 2. There is an inside hardened race that is pressed onto the drive shaft for the Roller Bearing that doesn't...

Looks like I'm rolling the rear axle out anyway, I'll check everything mentioned here including that bushing you mentioned Mark, thanks!

It's like I always say...fun just never quits!

The guy I got the rear axle from told me that it was rebuilt...I never believe that and besides the only real way to make sure things are as they should be is to go through it myself. As it turned out it may have been rebuilt at some point, but it certainly wasn't in 1978 when I got it...it had bab...

Ok, my car doesn't make the banging sound when stationary, and also doesn't make the sound when in low either, but as soon as you go to direct drive (hi), the banging starts, as you reach cruising speed it goes away, until you decelerate, then it starts up again. It only makes this sound moving for...

Banging is fairly true to what I'm hearing (seemingly from directly underneath the front floorboards), problem is I'm not sure where it is coming from (sound has a way of traveling under that car), other than I know it is under the car. I thought at first it was coming from the rear end, so I pop o...

That was going to be my suggestion too Steve, the rings...everything else seemed to be sort of correct. One thing though, did you also grind the valve seats on the block when you did the valves? I mean did you do them separately from the valves? It's important to level the playing field first, then...

Bob, it's fixed now.

Martynn

Bob, I've got my IT guy looking into it.

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