Pretty Brass Carbs.

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Duey_C
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Pretty Brass Carbs.

Post by Duey_C » Wed Apr 29, 2020 11:33 pm

You all know "Uncle" Stan Howe as an automobile carburetor restoration specialist. Stromberg OS might just be a specialty...
I know something others may not know... Stan does Old Tractor carburetors too. Sshhh...

Note how Old Tractor and OT fit together? Huh? Huh? See it? Huh? :lol: :lol: :D

Just wanted to show a carb that Stan had put on his shelf for me. I had ordered it, payed the busy man and knew I'd need to wait awhile.
Sent a couple emails along the way to let Stan know the engine wasn't ready yet anyhow.
Sshhh... AKA, Maw was on my axx. She knew darn well it'll take a bit but pushed me to pester. Fine. :roll:
Out of the Blue yester evening, as if he knew I'm getting closer, here comes a box, the mail carrier put it at the wrong place and neighbor Rick brought it over with his usual smile!
OH XXXX! A Stan Howe carb! Ya wanna see it Rick? Hang on!
I carefully cut that box open like a madman! Unable to speak coherent sentences to my neighbor at the moment!
I gently yanked that packing out! Looked at the extra bits! And then gently showed Rick my new carb!
Wow! He says, What's it for? I point at a rusty/sad HULK of a tractor... :lol:
He probly really wonders about his nice yet eccentric neighbor now!... :lol:
I really wanted a Stan Howe carb for a kind of special tractor.

Somewhere between 1926 and 1929, six 3 speed experimental tractors were produced. Two of the six apparently survive.
They had been developing a mid-sized engine and tractor since 1925. Plopping the emerging engine into an existing chassis for testing.
Perhaps a dozen of those 320 survive.
On October 1st of 1928, Twin City #X-4 with engine X-2 started testing in Nebraska test #152.
On January 1st of 1929, Minneapolis Steel and Machinery introduced to the general public the new Twin City 21-32 Tractor.
"Built to do the work not to meet the price." Yes, that is a quote. Edited for a correction.
Serial number 2 is in the yard and this Stromberg M-3 is correct for this tractor.

A couple shots of Stan's carb and one of a SIMILAR M-3 that I picked up along the way from my Twin City Tractor Dealer.
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Last edited by Duey_C on Fri May 01, 2020 2:24 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Pretty Brass Carbs.

Post by Duey_C » Wed Apr 29, 2020 11:48 pm

Don't think it would turn out in correct order. That's OK.
The new Twin City 21-32. I call that a Fruit Jar model as it has a jar on the bottom of the Donaldson air cleaner.
Oops. It did it twice. EDIT: We can still edit this long after posting! Thank you Admin!
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Wayne Sheldon
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Re: Pretty Brass Carbs.

Post by Wayne Sheldon » Thu Apr 30, 2020 4:32 am

Nice! Nice! Nice!
The carburetor, Stan, and the Twin City tractor!
And one more nice! Thank you for sharing this "OT"!

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perry kete
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Re: Pretty Brass Carbs.

Post by perry kete » Thu Apr 30, 2020 7:50 am

You are going to post a video of that engine running with that beautiful carb on it aren't you...
1922 Coupe & 1927 Touring

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Re: Pretty Brass Carbs.

Post by Duey_C » Thu Apr 30, 2020 7:56 pm

Wayne. Thank you. This OT section is a blessing. My mind has been so busy with these Twin City's, I don't touch the T's... :(
The 18 is at a friend's in the shed yet but the 24 has been patiently watching me with his two "eyes".
I'm so odd, I leave the headlamps uncovered to they can see.
I have a thread on another site about Twin City small tractors on a whim that's right on 30 pages of info...
Some mindless. Some prudent and modern.
Got nine of the blame things. One to go...
Haves: Smallest to largest but they must say Twin City on the rad:
JTU
KT
MTA (2) People ask me sometimes, in conversation, is that a Farmall? Nope, a Twin City built in Minneapolis. :lol:
17-28 (2 of them, 30 serials apart)
21-32 (3 of them. #2, #1217 and #5297) EDITED
Lots of work to do.
Have nots:
20-35/27-44 a Monster! Maybe this year, maybe not.

Denny, you betcha I will! I'll be crying, pottying my pants and all simultaneously on that day...
The only paint on that tractor is the "fresh cast iron" paint on the engine.
Shoot, now I gotta go potty.
:)
Last edited by Duey_C on Thu May 07, 2020 8:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Pretty Brass Carbs.

Post by Mark Gregush » Sat May 02, 2020 2:42 pm

If you want to have fun with people, put a little model of X brand (John Deere Ford etc) tractor in the air cleaner jar! I read about doing this over on SmokStack. :lol:
I know the voices aren't real but damn they have some good ideas! :shock:

1925 Cut down pickup
1920 Dodge touring
1948 Ford F2 pickup

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Re: Pretty Brass Carbs.

Post by HornsRus » Sat May 02, 2020 3:17 pm

my fwd uses that same carb.charley

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Re: Pretty Brass Carbs.

Post by Duey_C » Thu May 07, 2020 9:05 pm

Oops! I forgot I have three 21-32‘s. No wonder the math didn’t work. Edited above to include another 1929.
Hehehe! That would be too funny Mark! By gum, I have seen that before. You visit the Stak? Cool.
Sadly, I think the pic above is either of one of the six prototypes or a true artist’s rendition so no fruit jar in reality... Don’t even know where the two X’s are. Hush hush, ya know and I understand.
I am very pleased to have the unobtainium “banjo” air cleaner for this tractor and even the slightly smaller version on the ‘30 KT.
I should at least mock-up a fruit jar and one or two of my little HO or N gauge tractors inside the jar!

Charley, I’d like to see a pic of your FWD!

I am no Rich Eagle but I still need to fab a throttle lever out of brass or bronze I have here. ;) :)
It’ll be a compromise as I don’t believe I’ll ever see or find an original FE267F or G. Just needs the short arms and holes to hook up to the governor and the throttle lever rod and chain. I’ll leave this later arm in place for the stops and fit the throttle lever over the four sections of the stop arm for clamping on the shaft.
Yep, turning the first screw on a new carb was tough but had to be done. Highly adjustable carbs.
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Re: Pretty Brass Carbs.

Post by Duey_C » Fri Feb 05, 2021 1:27 am

There is SLOW progress on the engine for the pretty brass carb. Hoping this year to start it.
Having been upside down for quite a spell, the engine is upright again at least.
The turning. Looking much better! Ready for rebuilt heads while still waiting to fill the gaping hole in the front timing plate with machined parts. 414 cubes. 4-11/16 x 6, four cylinder. 900 pound engine.
2011...
Used with permission, this particular Stromberg M-3 carb was built for a National automobile in 2011.
Hence my question about signing up on the AACA site that's been troubling me.
To ask an almost unanswerable question. "Sir, do you have this throttle lever yet?" I'm quite certain the National automobile used something else.
See that throttle lever? Truth be told, it is an exceptionally rare throttle lever for a very early Twin City 21-32 tractor.
A small chain would hook into the small hole on the top with a bracket to pass thru for a rod for the throttle handle at the operators fingertips. The large hole on the left needs a steel bushing to accept the rod from the governor below.
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Re: Pretty Brass Carbs.

Post by Duey_C » Tue Mar 30, 2021 2:23 am

I've given up on trying to get into the AACA to ask that question above to a National owner that may peruse that site.
Devilish computers. Thank goodness MTFCA saved me.
Hey! For the readers here, any clue where to find a sheet of multi-layered, dead-soft aluminum .125"/1/8 gasket material that will squash to about .065"/1/16??? For the manifold sections. Need a sheet. :)
Mr. Gasket sells pre-made gaskets of such material for the moderns but won't tell more.
Percy's sells dead-soft aluminum 10 by 10 sheets supposedly but won't tell thickness. I know what I need to do. Get in touch. ;)
Anyhow, we have progress. I can relate to Paul and that monster Mack engine in his wonderful truck. Good grief the compression.
Next step in Pretty Brass Carbs:
I temped up the Stan Howe Stromberg M-3 carb to the engine tonight.
Also itchin' to see Mike's carbs in place. ;)
I also temped-up the unobtainium banjo air cleaner for fun.
Felt good. Real good.
Oh-oh, computer being a jerk. Try.
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Re: Pretty Brass Carbs.

Post by PDGx » Tue Mar 30, 2021 3:17 pm

Hopefully you have a spring loaded kick out on your hand crank. If not, beware. If you think a T is wicked - :shock:
Remember - power through the compression !

Aren’t those Stromberg M- series carbs great ? What did you do to preserve the shine on the carb long term ?

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Re: Pretty Brass Carbs.

Post by Michael Peternell » Tue Mar 30, 2021 7:59 pm

Can't wait to hear it on the mill or threshing machine at Pioneer Day's!

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Re: Pretty Brass Carbs.

Post by Duey_C » Wed Mar 31, 2021 2:46 am

Paul, I haven't used anything yet to preserve the shine. Been baffled for years about that.
Olive oil, "shellacs" or spray-on preservatives have been talked about in the past and someone doesn't like all of them. :?
You have any thoughts? I sure would like to hear. :) I need to re-visit your Mack thread again!
Aww darn it. I promise to keep those consarned crank springs in place. Thankfully, never been bitten that way.
I find them troubling. Oil/grease.
I've turned this engine over so darned many times it's starting to have some "spring"! I leave the spark plugs in for fun now.
Time to hang the flywheel back on. :)
Mack is 671? I forget. This one is a 413/414. The big TC here is a 641. Big engines none the less. ;)

Mike, wouldn't that be neat to upstage the next MM feature with Twin City tractors and engines? We need to try.
Without Twin City, there'd be no MM. Yet some parts still interchange... Think about that. :) Fun thoughts!
That's my "aim" old friend. Hear him grunt & babble at our show!
(I don't like the word "goal". Too modern like the word "team" as used nowadays........)
Need to keep the cobwebs out. Your dad told me that many years ago about the time I was to run the 6A at Rollag.
Makes me happy. :)
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Re: Pretty Brass Carbs.

Post by PDGx » Wed Mar 31, 2021 7:54 pm

Duey

The Mack is a 471 cid (5x6)

I tried to clear coat the polished carb, but after a year of running it, the heat and gas have pretty well returned it to what it was before cleaning it. Oh, well, it runs !

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Re: Pretty Brass Carbs.

Post by Michael Peternell » Sat Apr 03, 2021 10:03 pm

Here you go Duey! Back on the Cleveland.Can't wait to fire it up!
PXL_20210403_141350077.jpg
PXL_20210403_141334695.jpg

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Re: Pretty Brass Carbs.

Post by Duey_C » Sun Apr 04, 2021 12:29 am

Good info Paul. That was also the info I found years ago and yet a tractor friend claims it worked OK...
Thank you! I figured photos before it goes dark again and be happy with it. :)
Michael, that's just plain cool! That pretty carb on that stark engine block!
I see we have some more PA horns in the building and the engine is where it should be. ;) In a steamy sort of place...
Such a wonderful night and you guys ADD to it immensely!!! The fire has been re-lit and that's a blessing! Thank you.
Sshhh, got a line on another 21-32 Frankenstein Twin City that's CLOSE by. :)
And the four cut-offs hold air! It's a featured tractor of one of my yootub videos in 2000-19.
Cut-offs are steel wheels that have had the rims cut off and rubber tires/rims put in their place. Smoother/better efficiency.
Frankensteins are tractors that have been updated ruthlessly thru their long working years.
Here I thought I was doing good digging 92 years of grease and a long buried spider egg sack out of a cast fan pulley tonight...
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Re: Pretty Brass Carbs.

Post by PDGx » Sun Apr 04, 2021 9:27 am

Make sure you two post videos (with sound) of starting them the first time !

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Re: Pretty Brass Carbs.

Post by Duey_C » Thu Jul 08, 2021 1:48 am

You bet I will Paul. :-)
Just putzing with little things tonight as the engine is ready to go back in the tractor frame. Stripped down to make certain no oddball parts get broken during the lift and carry if something happens.
Mainly the manifold and round Purolater oil filter base.
Odd.
Fussing with finding oil filter elements that fit Twin City/MM Purolaters from 1929 into the 60's also.
Some "Labors of Love" take time but thought I needed a better photo of this engine after some fussing and reinstalling the manifold without gaskets to make certain the alignment and three brass nuts are set OK after paint. Again.
THEN I realized I should've painted the copy of the original FE243D, 2-1/2 x 18 pipe below the muffler after temping it all up.
Can you imagine a muffler up on top of this piece of pipe? No wonder the manifolds may have broken off and replaced back when.
Lucky fellow to have these pieces.
The oddball air cleaner gets to stay rusty as it's a tractor part and not an engine part. Makes for neat colors too.
Tomorrow, tomorrow. I love ya tomorrow, you're always a day away. Bah.
It cooled down here for bit and our ol' friend Stan's carb looks great in place even if temped up.
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Re: Pretty Brass Carbs.

Post by Angmar » Thu Jul 08, 2021 12:14 pm

Duey, that engine makes me drool! Please post "detailed" running videos!
Still crankin old iron

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