A dual plug ignition system

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Les Schubert
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A dual plug ignition system

Post by Les Schubert » Wed Mar 18, 2020 8:57 pm

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Les Schubert
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Re: A dual plug ignition system

Post by Les Schubert » Wed Mar 18, 2020 8:59 pm

First picture is cap to Bosch distributor adapter
Next Nissan dual plug distributor cap
Finally Onan dual plug coil


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Re: A dual plug ignition system

Post by Les Schubert » Wed Mar 18, 2020 9:07 pm

The Bosch distributor with the adapter
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Re: A dual plug ignition system

Post by Les Schubert » Wed Mar 18, 2020 9:08 pm

Nissan rotor with adapter to Bosch distributor
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Henry K. Lee
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Re: A dual plug ignition system

Post by Henry K. Lee » Wed Mar 18, 2020 9:42 pm

That is just Cheating Les and you know it..., Damn Good Idea!

LOL

Hank

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Re: A dual plug ignition system

Post by Henry K. Lee » Wed Mar 18, 2020 9:44 pm

I worked my butt off on a twin spark Nissan unit to get there!

Nice Work!

Hank


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Re: A dual plug ignition system

Post by Mitchell » Wed Mar 18, 2020 10:20 pm

I am very interested in this dual ignition. I am haveing trouble completely understanding what you are doing to accomplish this. I would really appreciate a few more clearer pictures and possibly some instructions to help.

Thanks for any and all help
Mitchell


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Re: A dual plug ignition system

Post by Kevin Pharis » Wed Mar 18, 2020 10:32 pm

I’m not sure that the 009 conversion is “cheating”... but sure is a loooooooot simpler than the other options...
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Re: A dual plug ignition system

Post by frontyboy » Wed Mar 18, 2020 11:29 pm

Why go to all that work when you can buy a Nippon Denso Nissan distributor from Advance auto parts for about $125.00. I did that for my dual spark Fronty head. just had to do a tiny bit of machine work to accept the dist drive gear and it fit right in. It comes with out a vacuum advance but centrifugal weights.

frontyboy


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Re: A dual plug ignition system

Post by Les Schubert » Thu Mar 19, 2020 11:47 am

Dick
I understand your concept I think.
Please explain how you have “energized” the production of the spark. I suspect that the Nissan distributor is for electronic ignition, so I guess that you have also incorporated all the relevant parts over just buying the distributor?

In my case I used a distributor that bolts onto the T. Made two simple adapters and bought a available coil that is designed to fire two plugs at the same time. Simple basic ignition system!


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Re: A dual plug ignition system

Post by Dan McEachern » Thu Mar 19, 2020 1:53 pm

The Nissan twin spark fires two standard 12 volt ignition coils. Modifying the distributor body is about the same amount of work as making the 009 body fit in a Bosch front plate. You do need reverse rotation gears, but I know a guy that makes those.


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Re: A dual plug ignition system

Post by Les Schubert » Thu Mar 19, 2020 4:21 pm

Dan
So who makes the gears. I’m trying to get a couple of cam gears for my timer elevators and have had NO success.
Thank you


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Re: A dual plug ignition system

Post by Kevin Pharis » Thu Mar 19, 2020 4:50 pm

I hear Dan at DMC gears does stuff like this... 😉

dmcgears@yahoo.com

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Re: A dual plug ignition system

Post by AndyClary » Thu Mar 19, 2020 6:00 pm

It's pretty easy to adapt the nissan distributor to a Bosch plate. It's easier to plug one set of holes and run single plug ignition, highly doubt you would notice a difference. A T overhead has a pretty open chamber, flame travel shouldn't be an issue. I run single plug and it's fine.

Andy

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Re: A dual plug ignition system

Post by RajoRacer » Thu Mar 19, 2020 10:31 pm

I'm going to have to disagree with you Andy regarding the comment of "highly doubt you would notice a difference" - I'm running the Nissan and fire all 8 plugs with twin ignition coils & switch on my BB RAJO- I have my fuel pump hooked up to the intake side of the switch and if I shut off the exhaust side plugs, the r.p.m. drop quite noticeably !


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Re: A dual plug ignition system

Post by frontyboy » Thu Mar 19, 2020 11:43 pm

I have not run mine yet as I'm about a year away from completion. I think what rajo said above, dual coils and the Nissan distributor
is easy peasy and I like easy peasy. Seems everyone falls in love with the oo9 Bosch but its a 50 year old design and I like easy and a far better design as far as I am concerned.

my opinon and 25 cents won't get you coffee at Micky D's

frontyboy


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Re: A dual plug ignition system

Post by Les Schubert » Thu Mar 19, 2020 11:54 pm

All I will say is I spent at most 2 hours making the two parts to convert the Bosch front plate distributor. I consider that pretty “easy peasy”.
Anyway have a great day and all the best


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Re: A dual plug ignition system

Post by Kevin Pharis » Fri Mar 20, 2020 12:06 am

Les, I’m wondering about the Onan coil...? Is it for a 2 cylinder engine with waste spark ignition?? Or is there 2 separate coils cast into one housing?? Do you intend to add a second set of points to the 009??

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Re: A dual plug ignition system

Post by AndyClary » Fri Mar 20, 2020 12:32 am

Steve, the nissan distributor doesn't fire both plugs at the same time. It's been a while since I dealt with one but I think the difference is around 5 degrees, you are probably shutting off the advanced bank. The Nissan ran the extra set of plugs for emissions, not performance.

Andy


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Re: A dual plug ignition system

Post by Les Schubert » Fri Mar 20, 2020 10:35 am

Kevin
The Onan coil is for a two cylinder engine and fires a “waste” spark each time. The points run off of the crank shaft.

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Re: A dual plug ignition system

Post by RajoRacer » Fri Mar 20, 2020 10:38 am

I realize the properties of the Nissan, Andy - I'm just stating that you can certainly "feel" the r.p.m. drop & increase when driving.

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Re: A dual plug ignition system

Post by AndyClary » Fri Mar 20, 2020 12:15 pm

No worries Steve, not everyone is familiar with all the odd things the automakers tried in the 80's.

Andy


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Re: A dual plug ignition system

Post by Les Schubert » Fri Mar 20, 2020 12:26 pm

Kevin
If I am unhappy with the performance I would consider adding a second set of points and 2 conventional coils.
So it appears that the Nissan distributor version is kind of a “fake “ dual ignition as one plug fires too late to contribute any true benefit to performance

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Re: A dual plug ignition system

Post by Kaiser » Fri Mar 20, 2020 1:01 pm

A point of caution considering a "waste spark" ignition system :
Old engines from the early years of the century (and i consider our beloved Ts to be in that category) usually have quite a large amount of unburnt fuel in the exhaust gases, specially when still cold.
This combined with the often less than perfect scavenging has lead to more than one muffler exploding when the "waste"spark manages to ignite the gases in the exhaust system through the open exhaust valve, :shock:
When in trouble, do not fear, blame the second engineer ! 8-)
Leo van Stirum, Netherlands
'23 Huckster, '66 CJ5 daily driver


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Re: A dual plug ignition system

Post by Les Schubert » Fri Mar 20, 2020 1:04 pm

Leo
To correct your misconceptions, this system would not involve a waste spark when installed on a model T dual plug head

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Re: A dual plug ignition system

Post by Kaiser » Fri Mar 20, 2020 1:15 pm

I understood that Les, just posted this as a word of caution for other posters because some posters were discussing the 'waste spark' idea
When in trouble, do not fear, blame the second engineer ! 8-)
Leo van Stirum, Netherlands
'23 Huckster, '66 CJ5 daily driver

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