Battery for cold starts
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Topic author - Posts: 22
- Joined: Mon Jan 28, 2019 11:47 am
- First Name: Mike
- Last Name: Schlitzkus
- Location: Montgomery Texas
Battery for cold starts
I am a new T owner and just purchased a 13 Touring car the person i bought it from used a 12 volt battery for cold weather starts. Should I use a 6 volt or 12 volt to fire the coils for cold starts? Would the 12 volt damage them?
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Re: Battery for cold starts
Are you hand cranking, or is there a starter on this car?
Scott Conger
Tyranny under the guise of law is still Tyranny
NH Full Flow Float Valves
Obsolete carburetor parts manufactured
Tyranny under the guise of law is still Tyranny
NH Full Flow Float Valves
Obsolete carburetor parts manufactured
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Re: Battery for cold starts
Oh, and welcome to the affliction!
Scott Conger
Tyranny under the guise of law is still Tyranny
NH Full Flow Float Valves
Obsolete carburetor parts manufactured
Tyranny under the guise of law is still Tyranny
NH Full Flow Float Valves
Obsolete carburetor parts manufactured
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Topic author - Posts: 22
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Re: Battery for cold starts
Hand crank as I understand the 13's do jot have the option for electric start.
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Re: Battery for cold starts
You're right that a stock 1913 has no starter, but Scott asked because sometimes people add one. A six volt battery is fine. With no starter it doesn't have to be a big one.
http://dauntlessgeezer.com/DG102.html
http://dauntlessgeezer.com/DG102.html
The inevitable often happens.
1915 Runabout
1923 Touring
1915 Runabout
1923 Touring
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Topic author - Posts: 22
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Re: Battery for cold starts
Thanks Steve, so the coils will be good with a 6 or 12 volt doesn't matter? I didn't know if the higher 12 volt would damage the coils.
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Re: Battery for cold starts
6v or 12v can damage a coil if left to "buzz" for an inordinate amount of time before the engine starts. With 12v you'll have less than half that time available before damage may occur.
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Topic author - Posts: 22
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Re: Battery for cold starts
Thanks Steve, I appreciate the info. I got a lot to learn about these cars.
Mike
Mike
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Re: Battery for cold starts
Make sure your battery connection for the coils never comes near the mag post. Even a brief connection of the mag to 6v will destroy the Ford magneto by de-magnetizing the flywheel magnets. jb
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Re: Battery for cold starts
May check first to see if the previous owner electrified the headlamps from original acetylene or the tail lamp from kerosene.
That may need 12v DC battery for the bulbs. 12v DC is fine for the coils and they will fire hotter than 6v DC. Only long running on battery will cause the points to degrade more with 12v DC vs. 6v DC.
Those trembler coils are designed to run and will really fire the plugs on the Ford magneto, that is AC, and gives up to 28-30v AC at road speed. Also, unless you know they are just done, those coils should be tuned and set by someone with correct equipment to mimic the magneto and to assure timing to fire of each coil, so the four are in sync. Happy motor that way.
That may need 12v DC battery for the bulbs. 12v DC is fine for the coils and they will fire hotter than 6v DC. Only long running on battery will cause the points to degrade more with 12v DC vs. 6v DC.
Those trembler coils are designed to run and will really fire the plugs on the Ford magneto, that is AC, and gives up to 28-30v AC at road speed. Also, unless you know they are just done, those coils should be tuned and set by someone with correct equipment to mimic the magneto and to assure timing to fire of each coil, so the four are in sync. Happy motor that way.
The best way is always the simplest. The attics of the world are cluttered up with complicated failures. Henry Ford
Don’t find fault, find a remedy; anybody can complain. Henry Ford
Don’t find fault, find a remedy; anybody can complain. Henry Ford
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Topic author - Posts: 22
- Joined: Mon Jan 28, 2019 11:47 am
- First Name: Mike
- Last Name: Schlitzkus
- Location: Montgomery Texas
Re: Battery for cold starts
Thanks Dan, the headlamps are the acetylene Ford Model 656 made by E&J the side lamps and tail lamp are the kerosene. It starts fine on warm days on magneto but when it is cold it needs the battery. I will check to see if someone around the Houston Texas area has the correct equipment to tune the timing of the coils.
Mike
Mike
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Re: Battery for cold starts
Mike
if it is cold weather that you're having trouble with, root cause may be the carb. If you have someone tune the coils, mention to them that you're starting on mag and they should set the coils to the lower side of the acceptable amp rating.
VERY IMPORTANT: search some threads regarding timing of the timer. You MUSTMUSTMUST have it timed correctly if you use a battery, as the battery will allow a mis-timed engine to fire before top dead center and can result in painful bruises or broken bones when cranking. If your timing lever must be down 4-5 notches to start on Mag, your timing is likely correct or close. Close can still hurt you. With a battery, the timer must be set correctly to crank position when the spark lever is all the way up (retarded).
My first T was a stem-winder, too. Not many make that their first foray into the hobby. My hat's off to you.
if it is cold weather that you're having trouble with, root cause may be the carb. If you have someone tune the coils, mention to them that you're starting on mag and they should set the coils to the lower side of the acceptable amp rating.
VERY IMPORTANT: search some threads regarding timing of the timer. You MUSTMUSTMUST have it timed correctly if you use a battery, as the battery will allow a mis-timed engine to fire before top dead center and can result in painful bruises or broken bones when cranking. If your timing lever must be down 4-5 notches to start on Mag, your timing is likely correct or close. Close can still hurt you. With a battery, the timer must be set correctly to crank position when the spark lever is all the way up (retarded).
My first T was a stem-winder, too. Not many make that their first foray into the hobby. My hat's off to you.
Scott Conger
Tyranny under the guise of law is still Tyranny
NH Full Flow Float Valves
Obsolete carburetor parts manufactured
Tyranny under the guise of law is still Tyranny
NH Full Flow Float Valves
Obsolete carburetor parts manufactured
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- Posts: 3299
- Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2019 10:56 am
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Re: Battery for cold starts
Mike
Here's a photo of one's add to non-starter T of a small 12v DC motorcycle style battery under the front seat. Should last a long time prior to trickle charge just using it for start ignition on your '13. Have fun with your new T!
Here's a photo of one's add to non-starter T of a small 12v DC motorcycle style battery under the front seat. Should last a long time prior to trickle charge just using it for start ignition on your '13. Have fun with your new T!
The best way is always the simplest. The attics of the world are cluttered up with complicated failures. Henry Ford
Don’t find fault, find a remedy; anybody can complain. Henry Ford
Don’t find fault, find a remedy; anybody can complain. Henry Ford
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Re: Battery for cold starts
I recall the old timers used dry cell flashlight batteries. The big rectangular 6V with thumb nuts on the posts, called a hot shot.
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Re: Battery for cold starts
per Dave,
this: https://www.batteryjunction.com/rayovac ... Q5EALw_wcB
unlike what Dan showed, this is not rechargeable but will give many starts
this: https://www.batteryjunction.com/rayovac ... Q5EALw_wcB
unlike what Dan showed, this is not rechargeable but will give many starts
Scott Conger
Tyranny under the guise of law is still Tyranny
NH Full Flow Float Valves
Obsolete carburetor parts manufactured
Tyranny under the guise of law is still Tyranny
NH Full Flow Float Valves
Obsolete carburetor parts manufactured
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Topic author - Posts: 22
- Joined: Mon Jan 28, 2019 11:47 am
- First Name: Mike
- Last Name: Schlitzkus
- Location: Montgomery Texas
Re: Battery for cold starts
Thanks to all of you for the information, I am amazed more everyday with this car. I am trying to research where it came from and who made the body that is very interesting as well.
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- First Name: Steve
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- MTFCA Number: 16175
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- Contact:
Re: Battery for cold starts
You can check or set your timing with this: http://dauntlessgeezer.com/DG97.html
The inevitable often happens.
1915 Runabout
1923 Touring
1915 Runabout
1923 Touring
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Topic author - Posts: 22
- Joined: Mon Jan 28, 2019 11:47 am
- First Name: Mike
- Last Name: Schlitzkus
- Location: Montgomery Texas
Re: Battery for cold starts
Thanks Steve, good info I will check the timing. I took the car out yesterday for a cruise first time I have drove a T it ran fine. Only thing I noticed since it doesn't have a water pump and it was warm here yesterday it heated up when I let it idle to much.
Mike
Mike
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Re: Battery for cold starts
Mike
just so you know...that's perfectly normal. The thermosyphon system will not tolerate a whole lot of stationary idling. So long as you can drive and climb hills without overheating, you're cooling system is operating as designed and is fine.
Quick story: I had my dad's car with new engine, shipped to Rapid City to 1. break in the engine for my dad, and 2. Run a National Tour. Of note, we took the long long mountain climbs easy, in low, with 1/3 throttle (we had stock rear end). Folks with Ruckstells ranged from amused to infuriated with our speed. Everyone passed us. As we crested hills and the motometer showed full hot and puffs of steam were coming out, we'd invariably find at least one car that had passed us blowing steam, coolant running everywhere, and the owner on the phone. Every single hill-top seemed to have at least one such owner. We on the other hand were only slightly less hot, but kept going, headed down hill, closed the throttle and within 1 mile the car was cool as a cucumber. The difference between an erruption and continuing the tour was we did not STOP and allow cooling to cease thus letting the stored heat in the engine to overwhelm the cooling system. As you are learning, early automobiles are very different creatures. Have fun with the learning, exploring and driving!
just so you know...that's perfectly normal. The thermosyphon system will not tolerate a whole lot of stationary idling. So long as you can drive and climb hills without overheating, you're cooling system is operating as designed and is fine.
Quick story: I had my dad's car with new engine, shipped to Rapid City to 1. break in the engine for my dad, and 2. Run a National Tour. Of note, we took the long long mountain climbs easy, in low, with 1/3 throttle (we had stock rear end). Folks with Ruckstells ranged from amused to infuriated with our speed. Everyone passed us. As we crested hills and the motometer showed full hot and puffs of steam were coming out, we'd invariably find at least one car that had passed us blowing steam, coolant running everywhere, and the owner on the phone. Every single hill-top seemed to have at least one such owner. We on the other hand were only slightly less hot, but kept going, headed down hill, closed the throttle and within 1 mile the car was cool as a cucumber. The difference between an erruption and continuing the tour was we did not STOP and allow cooling to cease thus letting the stored heat in the engine to overwhelm the cooling system. As you are learning, early automobiles are very different creatures. Have fun with the learning, exploring and driving!
Scott Conger
Tyranny under the guise of law is still Tyranny
NH Full Flow Float Valves
Obsolete carburetor parts manufactured
Tyranny under the guise of law is still Tyranny
NH Full Flow Float Valves
Obsolete carburetor parts manufactured