MTFCA Forum

I'm wanting to have my coils rebuilt I've contacted both Mize/Lawson. Have anyone had any experience with these guys? Looking for recommendations. Thanks

Brent did mine with the ECCT. Excellent job, and quick turn around

Brent Mize did mine a few years ago. Very reasonable price. Quick turnaround. And the coils come back looking brand new. I couldn’t believe the difference in how the engine ran after having them rebuilt.

I had Erik Larson do mine with ecct.
Fitz

I sent mine to osoloso in Minnesota. Kinda scetchty. Turns out he does great work! Almost free but not quite.

Ron Patterson did mine. Excellent. Brent Mize also has a great reputation.

What is the ball-park price range for a good coil rebuild?

I usually don’t respond due to being in business.
The price per coil is $40 for wood top and $50 for brass top due to added finishing and insulators.
That’s the price I have charged for the last ten years. Others rebuilders may differ. I got my guidance and training from Ron Patterson. He’s always been great to support and help me with problems and questions. His work is impeccable.
I can set them up on the Strobospark or the ECCT. That’s your call. I have no preference.
This is not advertisement but rather an answer to your question. All of this is on my website as well.
Thank you for your time,
Brent Mize

...And Brent is my coil man too. I ditto all the good recommendations above

I'm sure all of the names mentioned do fine work. Mize did my coils. Excellent turnaround time, customer service, and communication.

Darin

Brent, I don't think you should be shy about posting. Like anyone else in the T world, if you are knowledgeable, people want to hear it. I was HOPING someone in the profession would chime in. Thanks!
I wasn't asking for a to-the-penny quote. I just wanted to get some idea of what it costs, in general, to have a good job done.
I'm sure there are some guys doing it out there, and charging $10. But I'm not looking for a $10 coil job.
Thanks again to everyone who replied!

Richard, any of these guys mentioned will do good justice to a set of coils.
Brent, thank you for what you do and Bill, I believe that's what I paid also. Cheap. In the long term.
Blew me away too when I put some HOT coils in the box from Andy Loso up here! Need to drop some more on his deck...
I'm not concerned about which method they are set up with. HOT.
Mike, that reminded me of your dad... These guys know coils.
I turned the carb down a full turn. Vroom.

My 4 Ford Coils should be coming in the mail today.I sent them to Ron Patterson and the turn around was quick.
I put 4 that he fixed in the chassis that is now my pickup back in 2008 and I don't think the lid has been off but once since then.No need to remove it,the coils work.
I have not started the engine on my speedster project yet until those coils get here.I figure if there is any issues with starting,the coils will not be the issue and I can pass that and troubleshoot elsewhere.

I’ve done my own, using home made testers (recently FACT). But looking at those coils and hearing the price I have to say that I am tempted to get a set done professionally!

Matt

Several local guys here have had Erik Larson rebuild their coils and have all been super pleased with the performance. Adjusting them with the latest electronic device like the ECCT will allow the coils to all fire at the same amount of time for smoother and better performance. I would look to have them done by someone that uses the most sensitive and modern equipment.

Guys,
Don't knock the HCCT adjusted coils,
If done properly they would be the better choice for a model T on the magneto because they are set for Alternating Current (magneto supplied power) and not for Direct Current (battery supplied power) as Henry(RIP) intended. Granted, they are harder to adjust because there is more work with a HCCT than doing than an Electronic Tester but that's part of the game. I suppose the next step could be to buy a more modern car if you want less work and more speeeed....Regards Neil.

The HCCT is a wonderful piece of automotive history and innovation for testing Model T coils developed back in the day. It remains a viable tool for adjusting coils to the satisfaction of users today.

Neil Martin wrote: "If done properly they" (HCCT adjusted coils) "would be the better choice for a model T on the magneto because they are set for Alternating Current (magneto supplied power) and not for Direct Current (battery supplied power) as Henry(RIP) intended"

While this is certainly true for DC powered Buzz Box coil testers, it does not apply to more sophisticated DC powered electronic equipment capable of applying a fast DC pulse to the coil under test while accurately measuring the Time it takes the coil to fire spark. Adjusting all 4 coils for the same firing Time using this method (known as the Dwell Time to Fire method) has consistently earned praise over all other methods of adjustment from those who actually experienced the difference. The following explanation is offered to help explain why using DC to stimulate the coil under test can actually mimic normal Model T magneto operation more accurately than the HCCT.

The HCCT briskly cranked at 2 revolutions per second (120 RPM) produces an AC output voltage pulse that rises abnormally slow to an abnormally low voltage level compared with magneto output operating at normal engine speed (1000 RPM). Here is a plot illustrating the 120 RPM HCCT magneto voltage output (blue trace) compared with magneto output at normal engine speed (red trace - 1000RPM) and 12V DC battery operation (green trace). Note that 12V DC powered electronic test equipment pulse (Green trace) more closely mimics the positive magneto output pulse at normal engine speeds (Red Trace) compared with the briskly cranked HCCT output (Blue trace). The HCCT positive AC pulse takes over 8 times as long to reach its peak value (4V) that is less than 1/3 the amplitude of the magneto output (>12V) at normal engine speed. In summary, just because the Model T magneto output produces an Alternating Current does not mean the coil test stimulus Must be an Alternating Current pulse. A fast Direct Current pulse can actually mimic the magneto output voltage at normal operating speeds better than an abnormally slow rising Alternating Current pulse with abnormally low peak voltage value.

I'll still say, Don't knock the Hcctester for coil test and set up.
Mike Kossor, Re voltage traces on your graph and I was under the impression that the T magneto gave a voltage range of +or-- 8 to 28 volts .
Why don't you mention the maximum minus magneto voltage (That is the voltage generated under your zero line) generated in your formula? Doesn't it count in voltage feed to the coil bank. Try comparing output of a half wave rectified battery charger and a full wave rectified charger.
Why was the blue trace started at minus 4 volts and the other two at zero volts? I feel it is misleading .
In the comparison it is lagging about 16m/s .
Electricity is a fantastic subject especially in Model T's and I am willing to learn every day. Far beats watching T V.
My last Query... Your red trace, Is it a true trace from a T magneto or an electronic generated one? Your one seems too spikey.
Thanks for your time...Regards Neil.

Neil, I am not knocking the HCCT, I was responding to your comment which is not supported by the test data I have taken and contrary to the experience of others as explained in my post. Regarding your questions:

A typical Model T magneto will produce a voltage output in the range of 8V to 28V measured on an analog AC volt meter Operating at NORMAL engine RPM. That was my point! An HCCT does put out the same AC voltage waveform BUT with abnormally S L O W rise time that only reaches about 4V PEAK which would only measure about 2.3V on an AC volt meter at a BRISK hand cranking speed of 120 RPM.

Regarding magneto voltage polarity; The magneto does produce an AC voltage of positive and negative voltage pulses as illustrated in my diagram. At normal engine speed of 1000 RPM (Red Trace), the simulated magneto voltage pulses range between -18V to +18V. At briskly hand cranked speed, 120 RPM (Blue Trace), the simulated magneto voltage pulses range between -4V and +4V. Note that only a single magneto pulse cycle occurs (-4V to +4V back to -4V) at hand crank speed in the same time 8 cycles are produced (-18V to +18V to -18V) when the magneto is operating at normal engine speed (1000 RPM). My point is; the HCCT excitation of the coil under test is definitely AC as you stated BUT the voltage rise time abnormally slow AND abnormally low in peak voltage value; far different conditions than the coil actually operates at normal engine speed on magneto so not necessarily the best test conditions for adjusting coil points. Regarding voltage polarity; The coil functions fairly equally by positive voltage pulses and negative voltage pulses. Which polarity of voltage pulse the coils will be operated in your car depends upon how the magneto is wired. Once the spark lever is advanced to the 3rd magneto voltage pulse which typically provides best performance, the polarity of the voltage pulses will remain the same polarity (positive OR negative) regardless of engine RPM. The magneto voltage does NOT alternate polarity when the coil produces its spark. The coil begins charging when the magneto output rises from 0V and fires spark near the next voltage peak that occurs. This is why a fast 12V pulse of DC voltage is a good approximation of the magneto output operating at normal engine speeds and good for adjusting coil points.

The voltage wave forms I provided are simulated output, Not measured voltages. They serve to illustrate the relative relationships between voltage magnitude and time scale. I hope this information was informative and educational.