MTFCA Forum

So I've taken the plunge into the world of Model Ts, having bought a 25 TT about a month ago. It came at a great price, but as one might expect, also came in many, *many* boxes. That said, the assembly hasn't been too troublesome so far- I've got the crank/cams and all their accompanying gubbins in, the transmission stack on the block (with bands wired in place around the drums), and the whole shoot n' match mated with the oil pan.

I seem to have run into some trouble with the bands sitting in the pan however, and the hogs head installation that follows. See, the bands don't want to sit back far enough to be lined up with their drums, instead bunching up against the triple gears/flywheel area. My immediate thought is that the tapered part of the oil pan is too close to the tranny stack to allow the brake band to sit back, though my inexperience leaves me unsure. Any thoughts?

- Brett

Brett, Are you trying to use a 1926-7 wide drum brake band on the '25 transmission? Do you have a 3 dip or a 4 dip crankcase-pan? Are the removable ears on the bands on the left side? Just some thoughts. George

George,

Thanks for the help! It's a 3 dip pan, and all my removable ears are on the left side. I'm not sure about the brake bands; while my brake band is larger than the other 2, it seems to be the correct size of the corresponding drum. How close are the clearances back there typically? Am I making mountains out of mole hills, or is something else off here...

- Brett

All three bands on a 25 TT are the same width. If you have a wider one, it is incompatible with a 3 dip pan. If the brake drum is wider, you have a 26-7 trans
That will still fit, but you must use a narrow band.
Hope this helps.
Allan from down under.

That is a massive help Allan! Glad I asked... I'll see if I've got an extra band in a box somewhere. Thanks all!

- Brett

I did not ask which trans cover you have. A 3 dip pan needs a cover with the 3 diamond shaped pedals. The 26-7 covers with the wide brake and first gear pedals have the brake pedal shaft further to the rear to line up with the wider brake band.
Allan from down under.

Allan wrote: ↑

Tue Jul 07, 2020 10:07 pm

I did not ask which trans cover you have. A 3 dip pan needs a cover with the 3 diamond shaped pedals. The 26-7 covers with the wide brake and first gear pedals have the brake pedal shaft further to the rear to line up with the wider brake band.
Allan from down under.

This is something that's always puzzled me. I have a 26-7 with the wide brake band and 4 dip pan but my pedals are diamond shaped.

The type of pedal installed is imaterial in the scheme of things. Both do the same job. It is the location of the shafts which is varied, to account for the different applications. Why someone would change the wider pedals for the diamond shaped earlier ones is something I cannot fathom.

Allan from down under

Allan wrote: ↑

Wed Jul 08, 2020 2:45 am

The type of pedal installed is imaterial in the scheme of things. Both do the same job. It is the location of the shafts which is varied, to account for the different applications. Why someone would change the wider pedals for the diamond shaped earlier ones is something I cannot fathom.

Allan from down under

Allen,
When I got my Roadster it had a 4 dip pan and a wide pedal Hogs head with a screw-in mag post, but an narrow brake transmission. I've had a lot of challenges keeping the band's lined and in good working order. Would I have better luck with an earlier hogs head?
Thanks, and Happy Holidays!

PS: I'm building a touring powerplant for the car, but would like to keep the current one for a good running spare.

R/ Roger.

Paddy, sometimes people put the diamond shaped pedals on later engines installed in earlier cars to keep things looking original inside the car.

roger, I missed your last post. A late hogshead on an early trans will mean the brake band will hang off the back of the trans drum. This is not good. Not only will the different pedal spacing mean the band is clamped off centre, the band itself will be subject to real punishment. it will be hanging off the back of the drum and being chopped up by the interrupted surface around the 6 bolt bosses on the rear of the drum.
You have choices. The simplest is to fit an earlier hogshead, which will be compatible with the trans you have. Or you could fit a wide brake drum and its driven plate, and keep your existing hogshead, provided you have a 4 dip pan.

Allan from down under.

The correct transmission cover for the wide brake drum also has two bolts front top to bolt it to the engine block.

The pedals can be interchanged, by removing a rivet inside the cover for the Clutch pedal.

The pedal shaft spacing on the 26/27 hogs head between the brake band and low speed band is wider to insure the brake pedal shaft is centered over the wider brake drum and band. You CANNOT use a 26/27 hogs head on a narrow band transmission as a third of brake band will be hanging off the narrow brake drum. The pedal types have no impact as the shafts are the same. In 26/27 (the Improved Ford) the Brake and low speed pedals were made wider than previous years. Another fact is the 26/27 hogs head will not fit on an earlier 09-25 engine because the ears bottom out on the back of the earlier engines, which is obvious because you can't seat the hogs head on the oil pan. To do so, you'd have to grinding down or cutting off the ears that normally mount to the 26/27 engine. As a previous post stated, you can use an narrow band on a 26/27 transmission with a 26/27 hogs head, but for the love of life I'm not sure why you'd want to downgrade the braking this way...26/27 brake bands are readily available.

Just my 2-cents.

R/Mark

Ok, thanks. I'll try to find a local, earlier hogs head for the 'spare'.

Next; nobody knows anything about the aftermarket 'Rusco' hinged bands?I

R/ Roger.

Thanks Scott!