mystery car
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Topic author - Posts: 365
- Joined: Thu Jan 17, 2019 11:52 am
- First Name: David
- Last Name: Menzies
- * REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1926 Touring and 1915 Touring both Canadian models
- Location: British Columbia
- MTFCA Number: 27825
- Board Member Since: 2012
mystery car
Help ident this car
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- Posts: 3672
- Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2019 3:13 pm
- First Name: Wayne
- Last Name: Sheldon
- * REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1915 Runabout 1913 Speedster
- Location: Grass Valley California, USA
- Board Member Since: 2005
Re: mystery car
The one and only Reeve's Octo-auto. One of automotive history's most famous flops. It was made on the chassis/body of the large model Overland if I recall correctly. Reeve's tried marketing this one for about a year with not a single sale. It was quite expensive! He/they then reduced the car down to a six wheel touring car, still no sales. After about another year, they built a second sexto-auto using a Stutz Bulldog touring base. Even more expensive. Still no sales. History says that both the Overland and Stutz cars were returned to their original configuration and sold as used cars. Rumors still persist to this day that they still exist, and are hidden away somewhere. Several people have claimed that they know who has them, but won't tell where they are. During William Harrah's reign as the top automobile collector, he advertised and searched for both the Overland and Stutz models almost continuously, and owned and restored an unusual number of both (a good friend has one of Bill Harrah's 1913 Stutz Bulldog touring cars and I have ridden in it a few times). It would appear that he did not believe the rumors of the cars still existing, and was looking for any remnants of the original modified chassis or other pieces. But that is just speculation on my part.
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- Posts: 1724
- Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2019 10:50 am
- First Name: James
- Last Name: Jarzabek
- Location: Dayton, OH
- MTFCA Number: 29562
- MTFCI Number: 24398
- Board Member Since: 2008
- Contact:
I tried the same thing
Wayne
I read this before but didn’t know Harrah
was searching for it - interesting side note
When I first started hauling in 2006,
it was with a custom triple axle open trailer
I had the dumb idea that adding a fourth axle
would be a good idea to help distribute weight
Bad Idea
It just added to the drag and made the trailer
difficult to turn - tire scuffing was a problem
So I went back to three axles
I miss that trailer sometimes
But as I started to transport early cars and Model T’s
it became necessary to evolve to an enclosed trailer
FJ
I read this before but didn’t know Harrah
was searching for it - interesting side note
When I first started hauling in 2006,
it was with a custom triple axle open trailer
I had the dumb idea that adding a fourth axle
would be a good idea to help distribute weight
Bad Idea
It just added to the drag and made the trailer
difficult to turn - tire scuffing was a problem
So I went back to three axles
I miss that trailer sometimes
But as I started to transport early cars and Model T’s
it became necessary to evolve to an enclosed trailer
FJ
Google “ Model T Transport “
MTFCA - MTFCI - MAFCA Member
MTFCA - MTFCI - MAFCA Member
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- Posts: 5456
- Joined: Tue Jan 08, 2019 4:56 pm
- First Name: Frank
- Last Name: Brandi
- * REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: Speedster (1919 w 1926)
- Location: Moline IL
- Board Member Since: 2018
Re: mystery car
More info on the Mystery Car. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Milton_Reeves
Wonder what the real story is behind the name of the "SexTo-Auto". Would sell Today with the right options
Wonder what the real story is behind the name of the "SexTo-Auto". Would sell Today with the right options
The past is a great place and I don't want to erase it or to regret it, but I don't want to be its prisoner either.
Mick Jagger
Mick Jagger
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- Posts: 3672
- Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2019 3:13 pm
- First Name: Wayne
- Last Name: Sheldon
- * REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1915 Runabout 1913 Speedster
- Location: Grass Valley California, USA
- Board Member Since: 2005
Re: mystery car
Frank B, The words we use for numbers date back at least as far as the Roman Empire days (Roman numerals not withstanding). By the time they reached our Anglo-Saxon roots, they had morphed a bit, but are still recognizable.
In Latin, it is; unus, duo, tres, quattuor, quinque, sex, septem, octo and onward. (without some appropriate notations I do not know how to apply on computer)
In German (Deutsche) it is eins, zwei (pronounced tsvie), drei, vier (pronounced fee-ah), funf, sechs (pronounced zex), sieben. acht, neun, zehn. (Also lacking the notations I do not know how to apply on the computer.)
The "acht" in German derived from the "octo" in Latin and became our "eight". The "sechs" (pronounced as zex") in German derived from "sex" in Latin and became "six" in English.
Latin was widely taught in higher education (even most high schools) from centuries back until less than one century ago. Most people with higher education around 1900 had at least a basic understanding of Latin (I wish I did, I wanted to take it in school, but it had been dropped from the curriculum shortly before I got there). Latin is the primary root of French, Spanish, and German (Deutsche), and also much of English today. English gets a bit more convoluted as it has more origins from Northern tribal languages like Saxony and Gaelic than the other so-called "romance languages".
So they were just trying to show off their education by using Latin and calling those a "six-auto" or an "Eight-auto" in Latin. By the way, "auto" is also rooted in Latin.
You can find the "octo" and "sexto" in a number of places even today. An octagon is an eight sided geometric shape (stop sign), and a crazy woman taking drugs to have a multiple birth pregnancy became known as the "octo-mom". Six children in a single pregnancy are known as sextuplets. (Medical profession still uses a lot of Latin.)
Linguistics, and especially "etymology", are fascinating subjects! At least to me?
In Latin, it is; unus, duo, tres, quattuor, quinque, sex, septem, octo and onward. (without some appropriate notations I do not know how to apply on computer)
In German (Deutsche) it is eins, zwei (pronounced tsvie), drei, vier (pronounced fee-ah), funf, sechs (pronounced zex), sieben. acht, neun, zehn. (Also lacking the notations I do not know how to apply on the computer.)
The "acht" in German derived from the "octo" in Latin and became our "eight". The "sechs" (pronounced as zex") in German derived from "sex" in Latin and became "six" in English.
Latin was widely taught in higher education (even most high schools) from centuries back until less than one century ago. Most people with higher education around 1900 had at least a basic understanding of Latin (I wish I did, I wanted to take it in school, but it had been dropped from the curriculum shortly before I got there). Latin is the primary root of French, Spanish, and German (Deutsche), and also much of English today. English gets a bit more convoluted as it has more origins from Northern tribal languages like Saxony and Gaelic than the other so-called "romance languages".
So they were just trying to show off their education by using Latin and calling those a "six-auto" or an "Eight-auto" in Latin. By the way, "auto" is also rooted in Latin.
You can find the "octo" and "sexto" in a number of places even today. An octagon is an eight sided geometric shape (stop sign), and a crazy woman taking drugs to have a multiple birth pregnancy became known as the "octo-mom". Six children in a single pregnancy are known as sextuplets. (Medical profession still uses a lot of Latin.)
Linguistics, and especially "etymology", are fascinating subjects! At least to me?
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- Posts: 446
- Joined: Thu Jan 10, 2019 11:42 am
- First Name: Philip
- Last Name: Lawrence
- * REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1914 Touring
- Location: Auburn, CA
- MTFCA Number: 5591
- MTFCI Number: 25062
- Board Member Since: 2014
Re: mystery car
Wayne, I'd like to add a little back story to your Reeves Octoauto identification post. The Reeves Octoauto built by M.O.Reeves of Columbus, Indiana was in fact the brain child of an infamous fellow by the name of Professor Fate. Fate of course was famous for his Hannibal Twin 8 which was a competitor in the famous New York to Paris race in 1908. I understand Fates Hannibal Twin 8 still exists. Looking at old photos of both automobiles one can easily see a link between the two.
The Hannibal Twin 8 was a revolutionary design using twin rear engines and four rear wheels.
Just prior to the Great Race, the professor had attempted to patent the design but unfortunately had trusted his assistant Maximillian Meen to deliver the patent model, drawings and application paperwork to the U.S. Patent Office in Washington DC. In route Max had left everything on a train in his hurry to catch another connecting train on the way. He didn't tell the Professor until after the race which Fate had of course lost because of a technicality (he refused to accept the trophy because of it).
After losing the race and hearing of Max's failure to submit his only drawings and the application to patent office Professor Fate lost all interest in the Hannibal Twin 8 design project and gave up.
Reeves learned of Fate's design (more than likely from the famous race) and perhaps with financing from the Peoples Savings and Tust Company of which Reeves was President and of course also being Vice President of Reeves Pulley Company had the resources to create the Octoauto in 1911. Unfortunately for Professor Fate and W.O.Reeves neither design was successful commercially.
I cannot verify any of the above, to much time has passed since. Only diligent research may someday uncover the facts of the true story behind the Reeves Octoauto.
The Hannibal Twin 8 was a revolutionary design using twin rear engines and four rear wheels.
Just prior to the Great Race, the professor had attempted to patent the design but unfortunately had trusted his assistant Maximillian Meen to deliver the patent model, drawings and application paperwork to the U.S. Patent Office in Washington DC. In route Max had left everything on a train in his hurry to catch another connecting train on the way. He didn't tell the Professor until after the race which Fate had of course lost because of a technicality (he refused to accept the trophy because of it).
After losing the race and hearing of Max's failure to submit his only drawings and the application to patent office Professor Fate lost all interest in the Hannibal Twin 8 design project and gave up.
Reeves learned of Fate's design (more than likely from the famous race) and perhaps with financing from the Peoples Savings and Tust Company of which Reeves was President and of course also being Vice President of Reeves Pulley Company had the resources to create the Octoauto in 1911. Unfortunately for Professor Fate and W.O.Reeves neither design was successful commercially.
I cannot verify any of the above, to much time has passed since. Only diligent research may someday uncover the facts of the true story behind the Reeves Octoauto.
Last edited by Philip Lawrence on Sat Dec 12, 2020 4:17 am, edited 1 time in total.
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- Posts: 5456
- Joined: Tue Jan 08, 2019 4:56 pm
- First Name: Frank
- Last Name: Brandi
- * REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: Speedster (1919 w 1926)
- Location: Moline IL
- Board Member Since: 2018
Re: mystery car
Just for the record I was making a joke... No offense taken but it was good of you to make the references.Wayne Sheldon wrote: ↑Fri Dec 11, 2020 4:05 pmFrank B, The words we use for numbers date back at least as far as the Roman Empire .....
Latin was widely taught in higher education (even most high schools) from centuries back until less than one century ago. Most people with higher education around 1900 had at least a basic understanding of Latin ....
By the way, I had (1960's) 4 years of Latin in High School plus 2 years of German (was required learning then) & 2 more of German in College (also required for some majors). Grandparents & Parents spoke Italian when they didn't want the kids to know what they were saying - only words I learned in Italian can't be used in public
Trust me.. You didn't miss a thing by not having taken Latin.
The past is a great place and I don't want to erase it or to regret it, but I don't want to be its prisoner either.
Mick Jagger
Mick Jagger