MTFCA Forum

Hello all, Having just finished painting a whole set of wheels viewtopic.php?f=2&t=13134&start=100 I am moving on to doing some more. This time the spokes are not mounted yet individual spokes in a box. I recall possibly Steve Jelf showing a picture of how to hang individual loose spokes for painting but cannot find the picture? I have many unmounted spokes to paint and would like suggestions on how to hang them for maximum painting efficiency. Regards, -- IV

I don't know how efficient it was, but I tied wire around the tenons.

The attached link to my experience brush priming and brush painting my spokes in 2011, prior to pressing them in place using John Regans spoke press design addresses the important point of not painting the mating surfaces or the dowels that go into the rim holes. I did so and the paint added so much more combined thickness to the width of the spokes that they would not press in place,so I had to scrape off the paint from the flat mating surfaces from each spoke and the dowels, which enabled them to be pressed in place, after which, I touched up the pressed in spokes and dowel ends to seal the joints. Jim Patrick.

www.mtfca.com/discus/messages/179374/186068.html

I cut up a couple of coat hangers and bent the pieces into a "V" shape. I sharpened the ends so that they would bite into the spoke a bit.

I have a paint gun and hangers for car body parts but did not use them when painting the spokes. What i did do was lay them out side by side with a minimum gap and spray painted. It is efficient as far as paint usage from a rattle can but not efficient by time to dry, flipping sides. If you are using a paint gun then of course you want to do it all at one time and suspend them.

Do you put masking tape on the faces that are not supposed to be painted?

Steve Jelf wrote: ↑

Thu Jan 28, 2021 1:10 am

I don't know how efficient it was, but I tied wire around the tenons.


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Whatever the method, wheels are difficult to paint. As I recall from previous posts, wheels were dipped then "spin-dried" in the factory. Like most factory methods, not necessarily practical for the home restorer. I have always painted artillery wheels after assembly, both by spray painting and with a brush. I would have to say brush painting an assembled wheel gave the best results. For those who paint parts then assemble, there really is some benefit to be had from "filling" all of the interstices between spokes, hub plates and tenons by painting after assembly.

I did not mask the faces that were unpainted, but I used a brush, so I didn't have a problem with over spray. I if I felt a ridge of paint at the edges after the spokes were dry, I lightly sanded it away.

If I had sprayed the spokes, I certainly would have masked the areas that were supposed to stay bare wood. Tedious, but worth it IMO.

Rich, I would assemble first then paint but I have a set that are powder coated felloe and hub and am going to do the varnished spokes. So I think that puts me in the category of have to varnish first. I have another assembled set that I am just going to strip and paint the 'normal' way all at once.

Rich Bingham wrote: ↑

Thu Jan 28, 2021 5:51 pm

Whatever the method, wheels are difficult to paint. As I recall from previous posts, wheels were dipped then "spin-dried" in the factory. Like most factory methods, not necessarily practical for the home restorer. I have always painted artillery wheels after assembly, both by spray painting and with a brush. I would have to say brush painting an assembled wheel gave the best results. For those who paint parts then assemble, there really is some benefit to be had from "filling" all of the interstices between spokes, hub plates and tenons by painting after assembly.

Every time I try a brush it is brush stroke city. Foam brushes are better but still not as good as spray.

CudaMan wrote: ↑

Thu Jan 28, 2021 7:46 pm

I did not mask the faces that were unpainted, but I used a brush, so I didn't have a problem with over spray. I if I felt a ridge of paint at the edges after the spokes were dry, I lightly sanded it away.

If I had sprayed the spokes, I certainly would have masked the areas that were supposed to stay bare wood. Tedious, but worth it IMO.

What wood stain/stain color is generally used for wood look spokes? Here are samples: http://tinyurl.com/2gg4xh8n

CudaMan wrote: ↑

Thu Jan 28, 2021 8:50 am

I cut up a couple of coat hangers and bent the pieces into a "V" shape. I sharpened the ends so that they would bite into the spoke a bit.

Check out “Minwax Pecan Polyshades satin” one step stain/polyurethane spray. A very nice color polyurethane. Here are several pictures of the woodwork in the bathroom I stained it with. It will give you a idea of the color. Jim Patrick

I am not seeing that color at local Lowes. I am thinking Sedona Red...

Most polyurethanes do not have UV protectant. Always read the label, or you will be doing it again.
Make sure what you are using is made for exterior use, unless you are parking your car in the living room.

Here is the sealer and top coat that I used.

'Redwood natural tone' so the original factory natural wood stain was somewhat red?

Even with stain and seal, I would still do it assembled or at least the seal coat after assembly. That way you seal between the spokes, hub and flange plate.

I have no idea what the OEM natural tone was, I picked that tone because I liked the look.

My guess is there was no stain used at all, just the natural colour of the varnish and the hickory. I like the lighter finish you get these days with the clear spar urethane. Stick to marine finishes for maximum UV protection and long life, all applied after the wheel is built.

Allan from down under.

I posted a few days ago on another thread about what I used on the wheels on my Touring so sorry for the repeat.

I first used Minwax Cherry Wood Gel Stain to give the wood some color. I used enough till I liked the shade.

Next, I used several coats of Epifanes Varnish followed by a final coat of the Epifanes Matte since I wanted a matte finish.

I used a foam brush and it leveled out great and you can’t see any brush marks. The wheels on my Touring are non demountable so I did it all with the wheels completely assembled.


I would highly recommend the Epifanes. It is a quality product and I have been very satisfied with the results and the wheels have held up great over the last 10 years.

I ended up using Minwax cherry stain and matching putty because I think the originals would look very pale like in the first picture. So here they are stained with a brush then wiped with a paper towel. I am going to be using PPG Shopline (Omni) clear coat automotive 2 coats after this sanding between coats. I am going to masking tape the adjacent tape faces.

Sorry to get back to you after the fact. Lowe’s no longer carries the Minwax Polyshades colored polyurethane spray. Home Depot does carry it, but Pecan is a popular color and often out of stock, so the last few times I have needed it, I ordered it from eBay. It takes quite a few coats to attain a nice, uniform coverage. The woodwork in my bathroom required about 6 coats, but the results were better than I imagined. Jim Patrick

I wish there was a way to easily mask off the adjacent faces that should not be painted. It is an irregular shape to cut out of masking tape 24 times. I wonder if there is a quick way to do it?

I doubt automotive finishes are suitable for use over timber. They rely on a stable substrate to be effective finishes over time.
There is no need to mask anything if you use a brush.

Hope this helps.
Allan from down under.

Using blue 3M painter’s masking tape, tape the faces and press down hard around the edges for tight stick, then take a new, very sharp utility razor blade, line it up with the edge and slice off the overhanging tape in a slicing motion, sliding the blade across the tape while pulling the blade in a one direction sawing motion like a knife through a steak. Jim Patrick

I'm sure I could brush a coat of clear onto the spoke quicker than I could mask the tapered ends. A second coat should take no longer than applying the first coat with a spraygun, and without the hassle of overspray and missed bits.

Hand brushing the spokes after the wheels have been assembled is even better. There is no problem with the fit of the spokes at the hub. Tenon ends can be sealed. The interface between the spokes at the hub will be sealed, and you don't have to devise a way to hold the individual pieces to work on them. It's a win, win, win, win way to go about it.

Allan from down under.

I've decided to not mask the adjacent faces and just sand them a bit afterwards on a belt sander. Here goes. The coat hanger clamp method worked well. Just make a little box with a linesman plier and they clamp well. Great idea. This is coat 1.

A belt sander sands very rapidly and there is the very real danger of removing too much or sanding at an angle that might make your spokes loose. Instead, please consider scraping the paint from the faces with the flat side of razor blade, perpendicular to the flat surface of the wood. Jim Patrick

Good idea.

jiminbartow wrote: ↑

Sun Feb 07, 2021 2:04 am

A belt sander sands very rapidly and there is the very real danger of removing too much or sanding at an angle that might make your spokes loose. Instead, please consider scraping the paint from the faces with the flat side of razor blade, perpendicular to the flat surface of the wood. Jim Patrick


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The belt sander could work to advantage by clamping it up side down and using the belt as a stationary surface plate. That way you have better control of the operation.], both in the amount of material removed and the accuracy offered by the control you can exert.

Allan from down under.

Or you could tape a piece of sandpaper to a flat surface, such as a table saw, and take a couple strokes to knock off any high spots.

Please stay away from sandpaper. The spokes have been made with a precision that ensures a tight fit. Taking off even a little bit of wood from each of the twelve flat surfaces will combine to possibly cause you to have a dangerously loose fit. Taking off just 1/64” of wood from each surface will combine for an overall removal of 3/16” of wood. Even that is enough to cause your spokes to fit loosely. Use a razor blade and scrape off only the paint. Jim Patrick

Jim, I share your concerns about removing too much wood, especially with a powered sander. Your scenario is even worse than you imagine. there are 24 faces on the 12 spokes. 24/64ths is 3/8". It makes me thankful that I have only ever had to deal with Canadian wheels which have the front to back taper which gives a double wedging effect to the built wheels. By lightly sanding on the narrow face of each spoke, the tightness of the wedge can be improved.

Allan from down under.

I used just Tung oil on my spokes. About 3 coats as I recall. Did not touch them for about 10 years, and finally decided to give them another coat. They still look good. Everyone thinks they are varnished with something. Formby's was the brand I could find. Tung oil was used by the Chinese to seal the Great Wall of China, it has been holding up pretty well I was told. I have been very happy with it. It takes less than 5 minutes per wheel and I do it right on the car. No masking, no sanding, and it seals all the surfaces.

Thank you for the correction Allan. My math is a little more than rusty. Jim Patrick

They are now sanded with 400 grit and razor bladed the first coat off of the adjacent faces. The first coat raised what felt like hair stubble in some places. It sanded off easily. I am going to let them sit for a day before I do coat number 2.

I do appreciate that we can experiment with ideas of how to do things, and we often come up with improvements which can change the hobby. In this case, you can pre paint the metal parts and put the wheel together as the factory did, and focus on a correct running wheel. Then touch up the wood fitment with sand paper or an emery strap, then paint or stain. During your life, the wheels will get wet when you wash them or when they get caught in the rain.

Ignatio, the "hair stubble" may well be the finish you applied getting to know any sealant/natural timber oils. Often they will react and cause minute bubbles in the coat being applied. It is generally not a problem with subsequent coats of finish product.

Hope this works for you.
Allan from down under.

Lots of tape for painting and boiled linseed oil on my spokes. These wheels were already assembled. This is what Leno said he does with is natural spoked wheels. Not a showy finish, but as my grandad would say “good enough for who it is for”.

They are done and so far look gorgeous. The big problem now is my powder coated hub top plate is stuck and won't go down to its proper depth. I was warned about this phenomenon with powder coat. I've tried sanding off some powder coat but so far no go. Other than that I am ready to press the wheel.