MTFCA Forum

Peter and his group are sorting out the racer, this time cranking by hand and scooting up the street. If you watch the slowed down later portion of the clip you can see and hear the difference as Alan closes the auxiliary exhaust ports after the motor starts.

Click on the link below to see the video:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/2fnwqaugb6orx ... M.mov?dl=0

Wow! He certainly did "scoot up the street." Fun, Fun!

"That was totally wicked!!!"
The Incredibles.
Naughty and getting ready to go Rob! That racer is the most-ut!
Someone IS going to soil their trousers... Hehehe!
Ooh, ooh, ooh! Right hand throttle! Yesss.

Nice!

Sweet!! Looking fantastic. Thanks for the update.

An unexpected delight.
Thanks for that.
Rich

Rob what is the gear ratio... nice video... seems fast...Robert

Robert,
It has standard T gears now. Peter's going to put 3:1 in and we'll see how that works. He thought he could burn the tires now. I wish I knew what rpm the motor was meant to run comfortably, but haven't found anything along those lines. On the 1912 Algonquin hill climb both Ford racers (228 and 410 cu.in.) were reported to have 2:1 diff ratio, but that's hard for me to believe, especially for a hill climb. I guess a Colby and Mercer each had 2.5:1, so who knows?

Wow! Will you be bringing it to Hershey this year?

Mark, not sure what will happen that far out. It would be fun to run around Hershey (town and swap meet). Still, the K is hard to beat when it's time to take a car out and about. We may take three to New London to New Brighton this year, the K, F and T racer (running the racer on the pre-tours at New London). I hope to have it on the road and hill climb at the Speedster Reunion (Speedway Motors) this June in Lincoln, NE.

I wonder if they would let you run the racer on the track with the other guys near the red field?

For whatever it is worth? A very good friend has a very authentically restored T racing car, with a BB Rajo, period racing carburetor, Bosch magneto and Muncie with overdrive followed by 3 to 1 rear end gears. The final ratio is (if I recall correctly) about 2.1 to 1 in overdrive. He has driven the car all across the country on tours and spends many hours in overdrive. He has also been clocked at 95 mph a couple times. This with a model T crankshaft!
The advantage he has of course is that the use of overdrive is optional. Keeping your car "era correct" for 1911 doesn't allow that choice. So running a 2 to 1 about ratio isn't really a good choice. I do think that 3 to 1 would work fine. Your "special" engine can probably handle the low speeds you will need with a 3 to 1 gear ratio as long as you don't work it hard at those low speeds. With its heavier crankshaft, it probably can lug down under light loads better than a standard model T can. And I have known several people to run 3 to 1 gears without any underdrive or intermediate gears of any kind. Both stock bodies and speedsters.

WOW ! you guys are really making progress, great to see and hear it run.
If you could check the ratio on the 410 racer in the HF, by turning the crank and counting rear axle revolutions, you would be able to ascertain the correct ratio, as it the same as on your racer according to the table of specs from the 1912 'the Automobile'
I don't think a 2in1 is strange for the time and might be correct, races were on 'unimproved' roads i.e. gravel and sand mostly, and the roads would be closed, besides tyres were (are) narrow so most turns would be navigated with considerable wheelspin, not much concern for lugging the engine there.
It amazes me every time i read about the times and speeds realised in the day, these drivers were fearless

Mark, great idea. When I'm sure about taking it to Hershey I'll look into that.

Wayne, besides being a "special" motor, it's almost twice as large as a T motor, at 300 cubic inches. I doubt there will be any problem with 3:1. Of course we won't know until we try. I wouldn't be opposed to an overdrive if it were small and not too obvious. I'm also hopeful I'll find more info at THF Benson LIbrary about these specials.

I was going to post a few drawings of -M- racing drawings, including several piston/bore dimensions. However, While going through blueprints, there were so many I have questions about that another thread may be in order.
Thanks all,
Rob

The VSCCA has hillclimbs for vintage cars at places ranging from Mt. Equinox VT, to one in PA, Hershey H.C. \

Roll bars are not required, just a lap belt and a fire extinguisher.

I bet they would let you run.

Thanks Erik,
Since it's my thread, off on a tangent.........

I think on early racers seat/lap belts could be a death sentence. Many drivers, including Frank Kulick, were thrown free and survived terrible wrecks. Had they rode it out, I suspect they wouldn't have survived. Just a non scientific opinion. Kulick wrecked the massive (over 1,000 cubic inch) Ford six cylinder racer twice within two and a half weeks, and survived both. Each time Henry Ford said he was finished with track racing. The second time he meant it, for a while:

The first serious wreck, September 14, 1907:
However, by early October, Frank Kulick was back at the wheel. This time with sanction and timers in place:
This time, Kulick was permanent injured, and wore a leg brace and walked with a limp the rest of his life. In both cases, I suspect he wouldn't have lived if he had "rode it out" with a lap belt. I think these machines disentegrated in severe wrecks, and the best outcome was being thrown clear of the wreckage.

Photo following the second wreck:
Frank Kulick with the six cylinder racer prior to the second wreck:

Rob

Step back to 1911. The Algonquin hill climb appears to be June 8th. Three days later there were races at the Hawthorne (Downs) race track in Chicago. Joe Jagersberger won the big race on the 11th. There might be mention of the Ford Racers at that track as well.

I would no more want to wear a seat belt in an open speedster than I would riding a motorcycle!

Rob, I will send you a message.

Another detail about early racing and gear ratios.
Long before there was an internet to spread information, and many of the people that had lived it were still around, some of us talked with the people that actually did the racing back in the '10s and '20s. Now, I never got to know any really famous drivers myself. However, on another end of the racing spectrum was the local fairgrounds circuits. A lot of racing was not AAA sanctioned.
I talked with and listened to quite a few people that had raced those local circuits. One story I heard several times was that one would often race on several different local area tracks. It was common to race on a quarter mile one weekend, and the neighboring full mile the next. Although we seldom restore our cars this way, it was rare in those early days for racing cars to have Ruckstells or auxiliary transmissions. They added weight, and the time to shift gears cost power time. So most real model T cut-down racing cars were a hot engine and whatever gears were in the rear end. The ratios that made a hot T competitive on a quarter mile track could not achieve a respectable speed on a half mile oval. And those 4 to ones would be silly on a full mile. Local hill climbs also varied considerably on what ratio was best. So what several old race drivers told me, and many others I knew that also got to know them, was that during the week between races, they routinely changed the gears in the rear end for the best ratio in the upcoming race weekend. A couple of fellows told me that they often had to change gears between races, and got so good that two guys could change the rear end gears in about twenty minutes. And I believe it. In my younger days, I once made a comparable change in the rear end in under an hour by myself.
Most people doing that sort of racing had 4 to 1, 3.63 to 1, and 3 to 1 (and sometimes even a 13 tooth pinion on a 36 tooth ring!), gear sets and would use what they knew from experience was best for a given race. Sometimes weather also could make a difference. One fellow told me an unexpected rain lowered the speed that could be handled on the turns, so in the hour before the race, he and his mechanic friend changed the gears down a notch to improve their acceleration out of the turns.

I would imagine that Ford may have done similar with their "Specials".

One of the speedsters I used to have, a racing car, had a drain hole and plug in the bottom of the rear end "pumpkin" to drain and catch the gear oil for quick changes of the rear end gears. I sure miss that car!

Dave, at some point I'll try to make a list of known Ford Special appearances including location, classification, date and results.

Thanks for the info Wayne. I know on at least two occasions Henry Ford or Frank Kulick commented after a race with the six cylinder racer that the motor was running good, but the car was geared incorrectly. Many of the Ford Special race pictures that survive show the racers with wire wheels. The wire wheel drawings for M-III (300 cu. in. motor) show a 32x4 tire. That would have given a quick change step up in gears to change out from 30 to 32 inch tire.

According to this online calculator, at 2,000 rpm, a car with 3;1 diff will go 4 mph faster with the two inch increase to 32 inch wheel/tire: