What year brass Model T?

Discuss all things Model T related.
Forum rules
If you need help logging in, or have question about how something works, use the Support forum located here Support Forum
Complete set of Forum Rules Forum Rules
User avatar

Topic author
WayneJ
Posts: 472
Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2019 8:15 pm
First Name: Wayne
Last Name: Jorgensen
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1915 Runabout, 1918 Runabout
Location: Batavia, IL
MTFCA Number: 31697
MTFCI Number: 23399
Board Member Since: 2013

What year brass Model T?

Post by WayneJ » Thu Jun 10, 2021 10:21 am

I learn a lot from the threads asking for help identifying a particular Model T. They really do provide quite the education. Here is a photo of a brass Model T made into a pickup truck from the Post 22 thread. What year would it be?
5AA80336-CA88-4208-B270-D0B0F5861C94.jpeg.jpg
5AA80336-CA88-4208-B270-D0B0F5861C94.jpeg.jpg (66.94 KiB) Viewed 1782 times
Wayne Jorgensen, Batavia, IL
1915 Runabout
1918 Runabout

User avatar

Steve Jelf
Posts: 6450
Joined: Fri Jan 04, 2019 9:37 pm
First Name: Steve
Last Name: Jelf
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1923 touring and a few projects
Location: Parkerfield, Kansas
MTFCA Number: 16175
MTFCI Number: 14758
Board Member Since: 2007
Contact:

Re: What year brass Model T?

Post by Steve Jelf » Thu Jun 10, 2021 10:30 am

Based on the windshield (straight up with braces) and the shape of the "door" opening, I'll guess 1912. Certainly no later than that.
The inevitable often happens.
1915 Runabout
1923 Touring

User avatar

Mark Nunn
Posts: 1099
Joined: Mon Jan 07, 2019 8:01 am
First Name: Mark
Last Name: Nunn
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1926 Runabout
Location: Bennington, NE
MTFCA Number: 50321
Board Member Since: 2017

Re: What year brass Model T?

Post by Mark Nunn » Thu Jun 10, 2021 1:26 pm

The front axle looks like it is for 1-piece spindles. The 2-piece spindles were released in January 1911.

User avatar

JTT3
Posts: 1315
Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2019 11:57 am
First Name: John
Last Name: Tannehill
Location: Hot Coffee, MS
MTFCA Number: 49460

Re: What year brass Model T?

Post by JTT3 » Thu Jun 10, 2021 1:35 pm

It appears to be a transition type body from 11 to 12 just looking at the seat and then the one piece firewall. Perhaps it’s a bitsa car and sometime later in the decade it was put together for work. The wood on the crank handle is gone so it had already been worked hard and put up wet. Headlights gone, sidelights gone.
Attachments
062C6843-EFE4-44F0-8905-8F2070B79C1D.jpeg
Last edited by JTT3 on Thu Jun 10, 2021 4:41 pm, edited 2 times in total.


ModelT46
Posts: 1454
Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2019 8:35 pm
First Name: Darel
Last Name: Leipold
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1910 touring
Location: Excelsior MN
MTFCA Number: 823
MTFCI Number: 953
Board Member Since: 1999

Re: What year brass Model T?

Post by ModelT46 » Thu Jun 10, 2021 1:50 pm

The seat is 1909-10. The lower section of the windshield is deep enough so that the upper dash board is not necessary. I would go for 1910.


ModelT46
Posts: 1454
Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2019 8:35 pm
First Name: Darel
Last Name: Leipold
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1910 touring
Location: Excelsior MN
MTFCA Number: 823
MTFCI Number: 953
Board Member Since: 1999

Re: What year brass Model T?

Post by ModelT46 » Thu Jun 10, 2021 1:51 pm

The front fenders without a lip could make this T a 1909

User avatar

JTT3
Posts: 1315
Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2019 11:57 am
First Name: John
Last Name: Tannehill
Location: Hot Coffee, MS
MTFCA Number: 49460

Re: What year brass Model T?

Post by JTT3 » Thu Jun 10, 2021 4:27 pm

Daryl the thing that is throwing me is the riser, it doesn’t look right for a 9,10, 11 or 12 plus I don’t see the indent on the hood former. Do you think that the bottom part of the body is remade by someone? If you look at the body mount bracket carriage bolts at mid and front, the midway bolt pattern looks right but the front pattern is odd. First I thought the front had 2 bolts which would be real early but there appears to be a third bolt that is totally different than any I’ve seen before.
Attachments
B4B37F40-E073-43D7-92E0-81BEC249EAFF.jpeg


Wayne Sheldon
Posts: 3606
Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2019 3:13 pm
First Name: Wayne
Last Name: Sheldon
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1915 Runabout 1913 Speedster
Location: Grass Valley California, USA
Board Member Since: 2005

Re: What year brass Model T?

Post by Wayne Sheldon » Thu Jun 10, 2021 7:42 pm

A bit of tough one. Clearly been around and worked hard, so it has had time for changes to have been made.
My immediate reaction would be that it is likely a 1911. However, I went to 'Post 22', enlarged the photo, and zoomed in fairly close. Details there stand out a bit more. The front body mount is the common three bolt type used 1910 and beyond. There is a scratch or paint mark or other unknown mark running over the third bolt head. The three bolt heads can be fairly easily seen while zoomed in.
The spindles are two-piece. The radiator neck is the tall one, early/mid 1911 and later.
The firewall has square corners, and to me at least looks like the 1912/'13/'14 style. Also no sign of the hood hinge notch as in the earlier hood formers.

Somewhere along the line, I had been led to believe that the 1912 mother-in-law roadsters had a metal risers and sides over wood framing rather than the mostly finished wood risers and sides. The seat also had a steel skin over wood framing. But when did this happen? I don't know if it was early or late in the year? I have seen a few photos of an original body that had the steel pieces, and showed some of the wood framing. But was this a common body? Or something unusual? I have also seen a few pictures of 1912 style roadsters that appeared to be mostly wood bodies. So, I remain confused.
The body of the car in this photo appears to be mostly wood. Although it otherwise looks like a 1912 mother-in-law roadster with the rear seat and riser removed, replaced by a pickup box.

So, is it a 1911 with a later firewall? Or a 1912 with earlier or later fenders (no bill)?
Another important detail on the car's fenders, is that the left front fender clearly had the bead on the inner skirt of the fender! That detail wasn't added until later in 1913 (some sources say even early 1914s had smooth inner skirts?)! The early 1913 model/style cars still had the smooth inner skirts. In 1913 model year alone, there were at least five variations of the front fenders. Earliest 1913 models had the 1912 style fenders with the bill, and smooth inner skirts. Beyond that, 1913 and 1914, I have never seen a really good breakdown of the progressive changes. The bead across the slopping back of the fenders was added, as was the bead around the inner skirt. However, I do not know in what order or the timelines of those changes. I have seen some original fenders with one of those, but not the other, so it wasn't a single change.
The earliest 1913 fenders had the bill, being basically a continuation of the 1912 fenders. Around the time the two beads were being added, the bill was dropped. Much of 1913 and 1914 had no bill. However, some 1913 production got the lip running straight down as in this photo. Other 1913 production got an angled or sloping lip. There are some era photos clearly showing this. Much (most?) 1914 had the straight down lip (if I recall correctly?).
Front fenders, lips and beads, can be confusing. Ford wasn't shall we say 'year consistent' with them? However, in this case, the left front fender is clearly mid 1913 to mid 1914! Whether the right is a match or not we can only speculate.
So we have a firewall that appears to be mid 1912 or later, a body that appears to be mid 1912 or earlier, and a fender that is clearly a 1913 or later. The car basically is probably either a 1911, or 1912, with a few parts been changed.

User avatar

JTT3
Posts: 1315
Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2019 11:57 am
First Name: John
Last Name: Tannehill
Location: Hot Coffee, MS
MTFCA Number: 49460

Re: What year brass Model T?

Post by JTT3 » Thu Jun 10, 2021 8:40 pm

The light forks are not 09/10 either. The radiator does not have the flying Ford. When was the support added to the fins on a brass radiator?
Attachments
CB975A2F-9838-400C-9B30-DC5F123DF42F.jpeg

Post Reply Previous topicNext topic