1925 To 1926 Model year crossover question.

[Mike Robinson]

Is it possible that during the change over to the improved 1926 T that any of the late 1925 Cars could have been built with the new 1926 Engine? I know most of the parts are very different from the frame up but is it possible that the new block was being produced before the end of the 1925 model year ?

[Kerry]

According to the Encyclopedia the answer is no, 07-02-25 for the block change for Aug 25 release of the 26 fiscal year.

[Norman Kling]

Unless, you can find the original title when the car was new, it's hard to know. You see, some of the assembly plants used up all the parts on hand before they started assembling the next model, so they could have run out of engines and still had a few bodies which needed engines. If you notice the transition from the straight windshield to slant windshield, there are some 22's that have the newer slant windshield which became the 23. To further complicate things, some states or countries would title the car according to the date first sold, even if before or after the "year model" of the car.
Norm

[DanTreace]

The Improved Car was much heralded on intro, some believed before it came out there would be a new motor with selective shift, but that didn't happen.

So unlikely any factory pre-Aug 25 cars had only the new motor and transmission before release of the new body styles.

But Ford knew that owners of older cars with the older engine would need parts to install that new Improved motor, in Aug of 1925.

Ford offered to dealers new floorboards with the wider pedal space to fit into the earlier bodies.

Replacemtent boards for Improved motor .jpeg (78.01 KiB) Viewed 1946 times

25 earlier board for Improved motor.JPG (73.02 KiB) Viewed 1946 times

[John kuehn]

It’s hard to say or be completely right to say that a late 25 T had a 26 engine in it. I would say probably not. But would it fit I would say yes being the difference in the floor boards and that would be about it I would think. An earlier 25 ignition would the same just not mounted on the engine. It could be that in later years people would do that when they added a 26 engine in the earlier year cars.
But from the factory probably not.

[sweet23]

Since the Ford assembly plants did not manufacture parts, but assembled cars from parts shipped from Detroit, Why would Ford ship parts in random amounts ? Other than hardware, It would seem unproductive to have more, or less parts than required to assemble any number of cars. I can understand that some parts could be lost or damaged requiring replacements sent, but cant understand why an assembly plant would have cars sitting around waiting on engines, rear axles, or any other major part. If a plant received the new engines, they should receive the new chassis and body to go with them. I am not talking about small changes that were implemented as new designs were made available.

[John kuehn]

I think your right sweet23. If there were any changes at all it would have been small or incidental parts and not major or large parts that were noticeably different. A case would be in the 25 T Coupes and the earlier “late 24 Coupes.”
The earlier late 24 Coupes had wood door frames whereas the 25 Coupes had metal door frames. You couldn’t see the change because it was covered. From then on T Coupe car door frames were metal. Not sure about the sedans though.

[Wayne Sheldon]

This one? I do not know for certain. And will not claim to know for certain.
I do remember there was a discussion about this several years ago (my computer ate my bookmarks!). In that discussion, several late 1925s were noted to have the 1926 style engine, and at least a couple of them had well enough known histories to believe the engine had never been changed.

One other thing I do know about model T Fords is that the saying "never say never" very much applies! A lot of history has been lost by the hobby because people wanted to "correct errors" in cars they were restoring. For DECADES everybody thought the 1914 model AND STYLE year ended and the 1915 model year began about September of 1914. It wasn't until later that proof was found that manufacturing problems delayed the introduction of the 1915 style open cars for several months, and that when production did begin, it went slowly with both 1914 and 1915 style cars being produced for most of four months! Hundreds of '1914' open cars were found to have 1915 engines in them. MOST of those cars had their engines changed to 1914 (or earlier?) engines by well meaning hobbyists trying to correct a mistake. As a result, very few late production1914 style Ts have their original 1915 engine.
While that is one of the most egregious such cases in the model T world, there are dozens of others. Several changes between 1912 and 1913. The improved body design between 1913 and 1914 (the 1913/'14 rear end also continued into early 1915 cars). A few oddities between 1922 and 1923 (or so I have been told?). And I know issues between 1923 and 1924, most notably different body styles introduced months apart. Then there was the 'side aprons on sedans' debacle for the late 1925s. A good number of sedans in late 1925 got the squared side aprons slated for 1926. Mostly fordor sedans, however apparently a few tudor sedans also got the 1926 style aprons/shields.

The only thing truly consistent with model T Fords is their inconsistency.

My apologies to people that want everything tied up neatly in a bow.

[ModelT46]

I feel that the main problem is that some stubborn collectors want to date their car by the date it was made and not as the model year as sold by the manufacture. An example is the recent 1910 Model T Touring, restored as it should be as a 1910 style, but sold as a 1909 becouse it was made in December of 1909. It is true that the 1914 styled Model T touring made in 1915 are often viewed as 1914s, but when originaly sold, they were 1915s. Same for the 1922 style coupes and probably the sedans were sold well into 1923 and were sold as 1923s. I owned one. It was titled as a 1923and was made in March of 1923 and was sold new as a 1923. I called it a 1922 because most T collectors would try to correct me and said it was a 1922 T.

[Wayne Sheldon]

Darel says,
" It is true that the 1914 styled Model T touring made in 1915 are often viewed as 1914s, but when originaly sold, they were 1915s."

Absolutely true! And that is a part of the history that has been largely lost because people try to make their car fit into their own delusion of what they think it should be, rather than what it was.

I would really love to have a LATE '1914' touring car, and proudly call it a 1915!

[Allan]

It seems a little odd to me that Auto manufacturers have assumed the authority to dictate a shift in the calendar. If a product is made in 1914, it is a 1914 product. Fast forward to the 60's and the production of Morris minis. From 1965 to 1967 they were never changed and from 1967 to 1968 only the pleating in the seats altered. The year of the car was determined by the date of manufacture shown on the ID plate.

All of this argument would go away if the date of manufacture was taken as the year of the vehicle, rather than the fanciful declaration that auto makers make about their upcoming 'new models'.

The only losers may be those with 1909 models who see a few so called 1909 produced 1910 models made late in the year being added to the register, but have the really lost anything?

Allan from down under.

[Kerry]

A new model release makes sense to be on a fiscal calendar year in the US, after all, who's going car shopping in the middle of winter.

[Allan]

That makes sense Frank, but then the manufacturers make a mockery of that when the new calendar year comes around. Then they heavily discount cars with the previous year on the plate, even though the new calendar year cars are the same. If it was built in 2018, it is a 2018 car. Just because Henry made changes to a car in August one year shouldn't mean the car is tagged as one from the next year.

Allan from down under.