PayPal

Discuss all things Model T related.
Forum rules
If you need help logging in, or have question about how something works, use the Support forum located here Support Forum
Complete set of Forum Rules Forum Rules

Topic author
Dropacent
Posts: 3384
Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2019 11:39 am
First Name: Tim
Last Name: Morsher
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1925TT, 1926 Martin-Parry bodied wagon, 1927 mercury bodied speedster
Location: Norwalk Ohio

PayPal

Post by Dropacent » Sun Aug 15, 2021 12:54 pm

Just putting this out there for info. Recent changes with PP have been cat n mouse like. If you’ve ever seen our sale ads, along with personal checks always being welcome from car people, for PayPal we request GIFT payment, which is an option through PP. The main reason for our PP request , other than the obvious of receiving our due, is it eliminates a scam that we suffered through.
Here is how it goes. Person buys something, uses PayPal payment protection, which charges the seller a fee. Buyer states there is something wrong and wants their money back. PayPal puts an immediate hold on funds in your account. Buyer is instructed to return goods, which are sent back , but instead of the goods being shipped back, just something that weighs as much as the original goods. As soon as it’s shipped back, the $$ is returned to the buyer and the seller ends up without the goods and without the $$, and it’s their word against yours.
It happened to us on a shipment to Paris, and we got nicked for over $500 with no recourse whatsoever.
After that, I said never again. We are ( almost) never in a big rush for $$ but as a convenience , PayPal is great for both buyer and seller as long as sent as GIFT. AND, also important, if you are dealing with someone you can trust.
So, if you have read this far, PP keeps changing the format to make your payment to friends or family, or GIFT, so it’s still there, but now you may need to look for it a bit more. Thanks!


speedytinc
Posts: 3840
Joined: Fri Feb 12, 2021 12:24 pm
First Name: john
Last Name: karvaly
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 14/15 wide track roadster. 23 touring, 27 roadster pickup, 20ish rajo touring
Location: orange, ca
MTFCA Number: 14383
Board Member Since: 2020

Re: PayPal

Post by speedytinc » Sun Aug 15, 2021 1:12 pm

Dropacent wrote:
Sun Aug 15, 2021 12:54 pm
Just putting this out there for info. Recent changes with PP have been cat n mouse like. If you’ve ever seen our sale ads, along with personal checks always being welcome from car people, for PayPal we request GIFT payment, which is an option through PP. The main reason for our PP request , other than the obvious of receiving our due, is it eliminates a scam that we suffered through.
Here is how it goes. Person buys something, uses PayPal payment protection, which charges the seller a fee. Buyer states there is something wrong and wants their money back. PayPal puts an immediate hold on funds in your account. Buyer is instructed to return goods, which are sent back , but instead of the goods being shipped back, just something that weighs as much as the original goods. As soon as it’s shipped back, the $$ is returned to the buyer and the seller ends up without the goods and without the $$, and it’s their word against yours.
It happened to us on a shipment to Paris, and we got nicked for over $500 with no recourse whatsoever.
After that, I said never again. We are ( almost) never in a big rush for $$ but as a convenience , PayPal is great for both buyer and seller as long as sent as GIFT. AND, also important, if you are dealing with someone you can trust.
So, if you have read this far, PP keeps changing the format to make your payment to friends or family, or GIFT, so it’s still there, but now you may need to look for it a bit more. Thanks!
On a slightly related situation. I received a notice today, my account was going to be suspended due to possible fraudulent use. Looked very real. 2 places to link to paypal. I went to google to get to my paypal account directly (not with their provided links) Nothing in my account about a problem or suspension. This pfish got away.


GG Gregory
Posts: 295
Joined: Sat Jul 20, 2019 3:05 pm
First Name: GG
Last Name: Gregory
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 27 Roadster
Location: Maryville Tn

Re: PayPal

Post by GG Gregory » Sun Aug 15, 2021 2:07 pm

I’ve noticed I had to look a little harder to find the “Family and Friends “ option the last purchase I made from you, Tim.

User avatar

Hudson29
Posts: 391
Joined: Fri Mar 01, 2019 1:51 pm
First Name: Paul
Last Name: O'Neil
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1914 Touring, 1923 Runabout
Location: Klamath Falls, OR
MTFCI Number: 18018
Board Member Since: 2005

Re: PayPal

Post by Hudson29 » Sun Aug 15, 2021 2:14 pm

Its not just PayPal that does this. I had an eBay buyer in Italy that gamed the system to cheat me out of $200.00 plus shipping by claiming a defect with no photos or any proof of any kind. He kept the item & got his money back. I lost the item, the shipping fee & the money. Ebay has a customer satisfaction policy that is implemented out of the seller's hide with no practical way to appeal. I closed my store and no longer sell on eBay.

Paul
The man with a watch always knows what time it is, the man with two watches is never sure.

User avatar

TRDxB2
Posts: 5409
Joined: Tue Jan 08, 2019 4:56 pm
First Name: Frank
Last Name: Brandi
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: Speedster (1919 w 1926)
Location: Moline IL
Board Member Since: 2018

Re: PayPal

Post by TRDxB2 » Sun Aug 15, 2021 3:06 pm

As for as eBay goes Seller's should set their return policy as "No Returns". Here are the options
When you sell on eBay, you need to state whether you accept returns or not, and if so, under what conditions. For example, you might assert who pays for return shipping or that you’re willing to accept returns for a specific period of time after a sale.
Whatever you decide your policy is, it needs to be clearly specified in your listings
.

If your policy is to accept returns, you can set up rules that automate the way that you manage different parts of the return process.
For example, you can create rules to:
- Accept some returns automatically, while continuing to process others manually
- Refund the buyer automatically and allow them to keep the item if the return shipping cost is higher than the item’s cost
- Provide different return addresses for different items
Handling some returns automatically not only saves you time, it’s also great customer service: the buyer gets their return request sorted right away. :o :shock: :evil: Maybe a reasonable idea for Bic Pens 20years ago - too many scammers now
The past is a great place and I don't want to erase it or to regret it, but I don't want to be its prisoner either.
Mick Jagger


Topic author
Dropacent
Posts: 3384
Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2019 11:39 am
First Name: Tim
Last Name: Morsher
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1925TT, 1926 Martin-Parry bodied wagon, 1927 mercury bodied speedster
Location: Norwalk Ohio

Re: PayPal

Post by Dropacent » Sun Aug 15, 2021 4:02 pm

That’s very incorrect advice, Frank. PayPal is completely separate from eBay. Marking things “no returns “ has no affect whatsoever as far as PayPal is concerned. I’m not here to debate 0r explain PayPal OR eBay, just to ‘splain why sellers ask for $$ with no strings attached. It isn5 geeed or trying to squeeze every penny. It’s for protection. AGAIN, IF YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS OR CONCERNS ABOUT THE SELLER, I’d BE SURe TO SEND IT THE REGULAR METHOD FOR PROTECTION
Don’t feel sorry for PayPal, they make millions from the “float” of these gift transactions. Nothing is free, and they aren’t a charity, but they do not lose $$

User avatar

A Whiteman
Posts: 992
Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2019 3:36 pm
First Name: Adrian
Last Name: Whiteman
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1926 TT, 1924 Colonial Roadster, 1924 'Bullnose' Morris, 1925 'Bullnose' Morris, 1936 JD AR
Location: South Island, New Zealand

Re: PayPal

Post by A Whiteman » Sun Aug 15, 2021 6:12 pm

On a different direction, New Zealand has for many years been used as a bit of an experimental place for banking methods and systems (we had EFTPOS/ATM cards a long time before they were common elsewhere for example).

Now, 'personal cheques' (checks in the US) have been phased out. They are no longer issued or accepted by any bank because "no one uses them and they cost too much to process". Both points can be demonstrably proven as false - but so what, the change has been made. Read - another step in the move to eliminate cash completely so all finance is 'online'.

YOU will be next!

User avatar

Will_Vanderburg
Posts: 811
Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2019 3:59 pm
First Name: William
Last Name: Vanderburg
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 2
Location: Jackson, NJ
MTFCA Number: 28382

Re: PayPal

Post by Will_Vanderburg » Sun Aug 15, 2021 6:20 pm

Putting No Returns in your add? Paypal doesn't care. It's buyer protection policy trumps everything.

Ebay no longer owns paypal, and will eventually be terminating the ability to use it to purchase on their platform using it.
William L Vanderburg

1925 Touring
1922 Center Door Sedan

User avatar

A Whiteman
Posts: 992
Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2019 3:36 pm
First Name: Adrian
Last Name: Whiteman
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1926 TT, 1924 Colonial Roadster, 1924 'Bullnose' Morris, 1925 'Bullnose' Morris, 1936 JD AR
Location: South Island, New Zealand

Re: PayPal

Post by A Whiteman » Sun Aug 15, 2021 6:35 pm

From a UK journalist:

"
Online marketplace eBay will now pay its sellers directly rather than through online payment giant PayPal under new rules which came into effect on 1 June, marking an end to a 19-year partnership. Buyers can still use PayPal to purchase items, but the selling process now takes place solely via eBay’s managed payments system from start to finish. eBay says the new system is simpler, more convenient and gives buyers more payment options. But Which? has spoken to one eBay user who is ditching the marketplace, after experiencing delayed payments under the new arrangement. Here, Which? looks at how the changes will affect buyers and sellers plus what protections eBay’s new system has.

Sellers Sellers will now be paid directly into their bank account and will have to manage their payments there instead of through PayPal. eBay selling fees are now automatically deducted from earnings at the time of sale and regardless of how the buyer pays. Seller payouts should now be consistently initiated Monday through Friday, within two business days of order confirmation. Sellers will no longer have PayPal fees, meaning the only charge will be eBay’s flat rate of 12.8% of the total sale plus a fixed fee of 30p, for all sales under £2,500. The old system was 10% for eBay, plus PayPal’s fees, plus 30p. Buyers Under the new system, there are more options for buyers, who can now pay with credit and debit cards, Apple Pay, Google Pay, PayPal, and PayPal Credit, eBay says. eBay and PayPal have agreed to keep PayPal as a payment option for customers until July 2023 when its agreement with eBay runs out.

Read more: https://www.which.co.uk/news/2021/06/eb ... d-sellers/ - Which?

What have eBay users said? The changes haven’t been welcomed by some eBay users. We spoke to one eBay seller who waited a week for money for an item she sold to be deposited into her account. ‘I have no wish to sell there again’

User avatar

CudaMan
Posts: 2385
Joined: Fri Jan 04, 2019 4:17 pm
First Name: Mark
Last Name: Strange
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1924 Cut Off Touring (now a pickup)
Location: Hillsboro, MO
MTFCA Number: 30944
MTFCI Number: 23667
Board Member Since: 2013

Re: PayPal

Post by CudaMan » Sun Aug 15, 2021 6:39 pm

Personally, being just a hobbyist and not a businessman, if I felt uneasy about a transaction to the point that I thought I needed buyer / seller protection, I'd probably reconsider and skip the transaction altogether. :)
Attachments
The_Blues_Brothers.jpg
Mark Strange
Hillsboro, MO
1924 Cut-off Touring (now a pickup)


Topic author
Dropacent
Posts: 3384
Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2019 11:39 am
First Name: Tim
Last Name: Morsher
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1925TT, 1926 Martin-Parry bodied wagon, 1927 mercury bodied speedster
Location: Norwalk Ohio

Re: PayPal

Post by Dropacent » Sun Aug 15, 2021 7:34 pm

You got that right, Mark!
1FA8DBDC-55B3-4FF3-A08D-309E10376FCB.jpeg


pre15dale
Posts: 146
Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2019 7:28 pm
First Name: Dale
Last Name: Kemmerer
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1909 touring 1911 open runabout
Location: Medford, OR1909

Re: PayPal

Post by pre15dale » Sun Aug 15, 2021 8:15 pm

I have a simple solution. I no longer use PayPal to buy or sell. I do not sell on eBay and have not bought anything on eBay for at least the last couple of years

User avatar

Ruxstel24
Posts: 2345
Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2019 11:25 am
First Name: Dave
Last Name: Hanlon
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 24 Touring car
Location: NE Ohio
MTFCA Number: 50191
Board Member Since: 2018

Re: PayPal

Post by Ruxstel24 » Fri Sep 03, 2021 8:26 am

It’s unfortunate since we all are pretty much friends and family here....
It’s almost insulting for someone not to trust enough to want buyer protection for a fee paid by the seller.
Basically taking money out of the seller’s pocket and giving it to whoever gets rich at PayPal.
People have a hard time justifying the cost of shipping sometimes but they can take money from a seller to give to PayPal without thinking twice. :?:

User avatar

Rich Eagle
Posts: 6795
Joined: Fri Jan 04, 2019 10:51 am
First Name: Richard
Last Name: Eagle
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1909 TR 1914 TR 1915 Rd 1920 Spdstr 1922 Coupe 1925 Tudor
Location: Idaho Falls, ID
MTFCA Number: 1219
Contact:

Re: PayPal

Post by Rich Eagle » Fri Sep 03, 2021 9:04 am

I was disappointed that to continue keeping my money in the PayPal account they want my SS number and an official photo ID. I'm not willing to do that so I have them send a check but it defeats the convenience for me not to have the money sitting there. I'm not sure the State wants me to copy my drivers license.
When did I do that?


Erik Johnson
Posts: 850
Joined: Mon Feb 04, 2019 10:25 pm
First Name: Erik
Last Name: Johnson
Location: Minneapolis, MN

Re: PayPal

Post by Erik Johnson » Fri Sep 03, 2021 10:01 am

It is my understanding that funds received via PayPal that are classified as a "gift" or "friends and family" transaction bypass 1099-K reporting.

Currently, the threshold for 1099-K reporting by third party payment processors is $20,000 and 200 transactions.

For tax year 2022, the 1099-K reporting threshold is $600 and no minimum amount of transactions.

In my opinion, anyone who has an inordinate number of "gift" or "friends and family" PayPal receipts may trigger a red flag and those transactions may ultimately be subject to 1099-K reporting. Again, this is just my opinion.

Regarding an eBay seller's return policy: even if an eBay seller's policy for a particular listing is no returns, per eBay's return and refund policies a buyer may return an item for a refund if it arrives damaged, does not match the description in the listing or is the wrong item.

Of course, buyers can game eBay's return policies. For example, if the buyer claims that an item arrived damaged, there is really no proof that it actually did arrive damaged. It is possible that a buyer who has remorse and changed their mind about buying an item intentionally damaged the item in order to return it for a refund.

Note that the eBay buyer is required to actually return the item in order to receive a refund. The seller is not required to issue a refund until they have received the returned item.

User avatar

TRDxB2
Posts: 5409
Joined: Tue Jan 08, 2019 4:56 pm
First Name: Frank
Last Name: Brandi
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: Speedster (1919 w 1926)
Location: Moline IL
Board Member Since: 2018

Re: PayPal

Post by TRDxB2 » Fri Sep 03, 2021 1:39 pm

There is also a subtlety in an eBay transaction that may have been over looked. :? Several months ago eBay changed its transaction process in that the transfer of funds (payments) were externally transacted between the accounts the buyer & seller had with the "third party's network" (PayPal, Credit Card..). What showed up previously on the PayPal side was you as the seller with the actual buyers name. Now that transactions is between eBay as the seller and the buyer as before. Now eBay depositing money into the actual seller's account becomes a transfer like to Family & Friends? Having said that, I have no idea what that makes eBay a "third party network" as it passes funds to the sellers bank account. But what it looks like some loophole where all the seller transactions are between the "third Party", PayPal for example, and eBay. So eBay gets the 1099-K? .
Now that Transfer of money, eBay to seller's bank account, may fall under a different Tax Rule, cash transaction reporting. Bottom line, there is no way the IRS going to be able to audit all 1099-K's. The party that sends the 1099-K needs your TIN (social security number if not a business). If you look at the attached form the IRS may have a threshold set on the values in Box 3 and Box 4 to trigger an audit.
1099-K 2021.png


Now the good news if you get a 1099-K. The amount on the 1099-K gets reported on Schedule C, another Tax Form. Here you get to report Business Expenses :lol: So save all your receipts for that Trip to swap meets , travel, lodging, meals etc as a business expense - Hershey here I come
Attachments
Schedule C pg1.png
Schedule C pg2.png
The past is a great place and I don't want to erase it or to regret it, but I don't want to be its prisoner either.
Mick Jagger


DHort
Posts: 2461
Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2019 1:30 pm
First Name: Dave
Last Name: Hjortnaes
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 24 Speedster, 20 touring
Location: Men Falls, WI
MTFCA Number: 28762
MTFCI Number: 22402

Re: PayPal

Post by DHort » Fri Sep 03, 2021 2:42 pm

Paypal screwed me too many times. VISA, MC, or check is the only way I do business now. An organization I belong to went PP or check, but they prefer PP. They said checks all have to be entered manually and they will take them if necessary. I sent them a check. Maybe they need a new processor.

User avatar

dykker5502
Posts: 410
Joined: Mon Jan 07, 2019 7:01 pm
First Name: Michael
Last Name: Deichmann
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1914 Touring, 1921 Roadster P/U, 1922 Fordor (danish custom body)
Location: Rågeleje, Denmark
MTFCA Number: 29116
Board Member Since: 2007

Re: PayPal

Post by dykker5502 » Sun Sep 05, 2021 8:48 pm

TRDxB2 wrote:
Sun Aug 15, 2021 3:06 pm
As for as eBay
eBay owns PayPal.
Ford Model T 1914 Touring
Ford Model T 1921 Roadster Pick-up
Ford Model T 1922 Fordor (danish build body)
ECCT, Strobospark, HCCT(Sold), Rebuilding coils

User avatar

Tim Rogers
Posts: 387
Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2019 11:04 am
First Name: Tim
Last Name: Rogers
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1925 Coupe & 1923 Runabout
Location: South of the Adirondacks
Board Member Since: 2013

Re: PayPal

Post by Tim Rogers » Sun Sep 05, 2021 9:30 pm

Ebay does not own Paypal...
<o><o><o><o> Tim Rogers - South of the Adirondacks - Forum member since 2013 <o><o><o><o>

User avatar

TRDxB2
Posts: 5409
Joined: Tue Jan 08, 2019 4:56 pm
First Name: Frank
Last Name: Brandi
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: Speedster (1919 w 1926)
Location: Moline IL
Board Member Since: 2018

Re: PayPal

Post by TRDxB2 » Mon Sep 06, 2021 1:11 am

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PayPal
Established in 1998 as Confinity, PayPal went public through an IPO in 2002. It became a wholly owned subsidiary of eBay later that year, valued at $1.5 billion. In 2015, eBay spun off PayPal to eBay's shareholders and PayPal became an independent company again. The company was ranked 134th on the 2021 Fortune 500 of the largest United States corporations by revenue.
''''
On January 31, 2018, eBay announced that "After the existing eBay-PayPal agreement ends in 2020, PayPal will remain a payment option for shoppers on eBay, but it won't be prominently featured ahead of debit and credit card options as it is today. PayPal will cease to process card payments for eBay at that time." The company will "instead begin working with Amsterdam-based Adyen".
The past is a great place and I don't want to erase it or to regret it, but I don't want to be its prisoner either.
Mick Jagger

User avatar

Ruxstel24
Posts: 2345
Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2019 11:25 am
First Name: Dave
Last Name: Hanlon
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 24 Touring car
Location: NE Ohio
MTFCA Number: 50191
Board Member Since: 2018

Re: PayPal

Post by Ruxstel24 » Mon Sep 20, 2021 11:15 am

Just received this with my last PayPal payment...
I will not be accepting payment through PayPal after this year. I’m not making a living selling Model T parts, and this is not gonna help anyone.
Attachments
3A72F33E-16A7-4EC7-9EE6-75E14231D75A.png


sweet23
Posts: 481
Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2019 1:19 pm
First Name: Darryl
Last Name: Bobzin
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 2, '25 T Runabouts, '14 Touring
Location: Kannapolis,NC
MTFCA Number: 27211
Board Member Since: 2016

Re: PayPal

Post by sweet23 » Mon Sep 20, 2021 4:17 pm

As government gets bigger, and controls more of our lives, we may in this hobby have to do more bartering & trading. Government is working hard to make us become a cashless society. Biden is right now working towards giving the IRS full power to look into our bank accounts at anytime for unreported income. All this leads us to a tougher time buying & selling antique car parts. I hate to think we will all need a card reader to have a swap meet booth, but it may come, and faster than any of us would care to believe. Lets face it, anyone under the age of 40 probably carries little to no cash already. Big government wont have a fight pushing through a cashless society. Get ready, we will all soon be paying taxes on all these parts & cars as they change hands.

User avatar

Henry K. Lee
Posts: 5339
Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2019 11:09 am
First Name: Henry
Last Name: Lee
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: Many
Location: South Pittsburg, TN
MTFCA Number: 479
MTFCA Life Member: YES

Re: PayPal

Post by Henry K. Lee » Mon Sep 20, 2021 4:23 pm

Not to mention.., Mr Biden is pushing a real good one.., lowering the inheritance tax from $650,000.00 down to $450,000.00. He is stating there are not enough wealthy to tax. These are combined gross assets.., so now they are reassessing properties, cars, etc. Estate planning has never been more important

Starting to sound like a real good deal to someone else not willing to work.

Hank

User avatar

TRDxB2
Posts: 5409
Joined: Tue Jan 08, 2019 4:56 pm
First Name: Frank
Last Name: Brandi
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: Speedster (1919 w 1926)
Location: Moline IL
Board Member Since: 2018

Re: PayPal

Post by TRDxB2 » Mon Sep 20, 2021 5:52 pm

Henry K. Lee wrote:
Mon Sep 20, 2021 4:23 pm
Not to mention.., Mr Biden is pushing a real good one.., lowering the inheritance tax from $650,000.00 down to $450,000.00. He is stating there are not enough wealthy to tax. These are combined gross assets.., so now they are reassessing properties, cars, etc. Estate planning has never been more important
Starting to sound like a real good deal to someone else not willing to work.
Hank
Think your blaming the "man" instead of his constituents. While the promise was not to raise Taxes (assumed to be Tax percent on income) of the so called "poor", most ever "plan" is to cause all people to to increase their reportable income which in turn puts them in a higher tax bracket and pay more taxes.
The past is a great place and I don't want to erase it or to regret it, but I don't want to be its prisoner either.
Mick Jagger

Post Reply Previous topicNext topic