MTFCA Forum

I am selling a rebuilt single stack magneto coil on eBay that was rebuilt in 2010 by Wally Szumoski of Chicago, IL. It is for use on 1919-1927 starter equipped cars. I remember that all of us were upset when Wally retired because he was the best. This mag coil has never been used because I originally purchased it to use on the engine rebuild of the 1926 Fordor sedan I am currently selling on eBay and no longer need it. Are the rebuilt magneto coils these days as good as the ones that Wally rebuilt? What kind of wait is there when ordering a rebuilt magneto coil? Jim Patrick

Well, your starting bid is more than the current price for one from "the usual suspects" BUT they do require a core first, so. . .

All the years I dealt with Wally they where never red glyptol, RV where red.

The ones these days have new wire in them not the old copper, at least the ones from Snyders are?

I agree Joe - Wally used a "clear" coat of some kind. He did mine for 30+ years !

Thank you for your input. A little clarification is in order on my part. The following information is listed in the description on eBay, but I figure I had better list it here as well. When I received the coil from Wally, I had never seen the clear yellow resin so I was unsure of whether it was heat cured or how well it would hold up inside the harsh environment of the transmission, but I was familiar with the protective qualities of Glyptal, so I took the extra precaution of applying a coat of Glyptal and heat treating it for two hours in a 250 degree oven as the instructions call for (www.mtfca.com/discus/messages/118802/152476.html). Since Glyptal is what Ford originally used to seal the magneto coils I figured it could only help. At the time, in July, 2010, I ordered two rebuilt coils from Wally. This one and the one I put in my 1926 coupe, which, at the time I was overhauling and applying Glyptal to the oil pan, engine block and hogshead. I applied Glyptal to the one I used as well and after 11 years, the Glyptal is still holding up great! The results of my curing the Glyptal coated magneto coils was a rock hard coating of Glyptal in addition to the clear yellow resin seal that Wally used so it should be extra well protected from the heat and oil of the running engine for as long as you own your T. I looked up the price of a rebuilt coil at Lang’s which is $299.00, which does not include the $50.00 core charge or the $25.00 or more shipping costs for the 16.6 lb. coil that will be incurred to ship the core to them. A $75.00 savings in addition to not having to wait for the coil and additional benefit of having a new coil rebuilt by Wally. Everyone have a Merry Christmas. Jim Patrick

Since Glyptal is what Ford originally used to seal the magneto coils...

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Steve Jelf wrote: ↑

Sat Dec 18, 2021 11:36 am

Since Glyptal is what Ford originally used to seal the magneto coils...

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I'm not sure when Glyptal was first manufactured and sold, but I doubt its been around for 100 years. Thirty, maybe 40, is more like it. The Glyptal website says the average Glyptal employee has been with the company some 20+ years. At any rate, its a good product and has earned its place as a staple in industry.

Glyptal is a Trade name of an alkyd additive to paint, and has been around 90+ years having been developed for GE in the late '20's. It's pretty much been co opted by the trades as "Glyptal" much as "Q Tip" is synonymous with cotton swabs.

It really is good stuff, but requires a bake as Jim mentioned, for it to become its best self. Few folks go that step and unfortunately don't achieve the level of protection that they could potentially get. Even when processed somewhat incorrectly, it provides very good protection within its design parameters.

I've seen that red primer looking stuff on some very old equipment.

Red Glyptal was developed by GE during the Model T era to use as a protective insulator for the windings of electric motors being developed by Thomas Edison. GE is the company started by Thomas Edison and since Edison and Henry Ford were very close, of course Ford adopted Glyptal for use on his Model T production line and, as it turned out, was the best product for the purpose of insulating the windings of the generator, starter and magneto coils. Jim Patrick

PS. I used to have an old antique can of Glyptal with an old paper label that said: “GE Glyptal”. One day, while I was overseas in the Marines, my Dad was cleaning out his shop and threw it away. I wish I still had that old can. I believe it was from the 1920’s or earlier.

Another name is insulating varnish.

Sprayon makes it in red (601) and clear (600). Prices vary widely. It pays to shop around.

I used the clear in my mag coil ring.

Here’s what I used in the mid 70’s. Krylon no.7004 insulating varnish and probably a form of glyptol. This can has been around 50+ years. I forgot I still had it. Then read this post and I remembered I kept the last can I had. Krylon was founded in 1947 and Glyptol was developed in the teens by GE or so I read online.
It’s interesting that Borden owned it along the way and sold its interests to others in the 90’s.

Reading the back of the can it must be some potent stuff. When I coated the mag ring on my first tare down of my 24 coupe in the seventies I sprayed it the same red color as J Bartows pic of his. It held up pretty well considering I cleaned up the mag ring with kerosene and dried it off, let dry and sprayed it! Nobody was rewinding them that Iknew off at the time.

Did you know that nearly 20% of oil heat is dispersed through the cast iron of the block on a early engines So, lets paint the inside of the engine with Glyptol, what a great idea!

Yeah, Kerry, but it sure helps the oil to drain off faster.

Many older industrial engines intended for long, heavy duty service, like Ajax gas engines, had the crankcase coated with red stuff or a white, epoxy looking material.

The T oil pan would do most of the heat rejection. Running an outside oiler would probably more than offset whatever heat transfer would be lost to a coat of glyptol in the crankcase and valve chamber. Most engines in the T era ran with from 1/16 to 1/4" of sludge coating most of the inside surfaces of the block and valve chamber.

I sure hope this doesn’t become a “ if you want to buy this, go to eBay” site. That’s frowned upon on many forums, and I’m glad so seldom done here. …… If you want to sell it, man-up, Or woman-up , put a price on it and offer it in the classifieds. You can always come down if you are trying to squeeze every nickel outa something. Jeesh ! JMHO

Dropacent wrote: ↑

Sat Dec 18, 2021 6:17 pm

I sure hope this doesn’t become a “ if you want to buy this, go to eBay” site. That’s frowned upon on many forums, and I’m glad so seldom done here. …… If you want to sell it, man-up, Or woman-up , put a price on it and offer it in the classifieds. You can always come down if you are trying to squeeze every nickel outa something. Jeesh ! JMHO

Thank you! I see these post as thinly vailed listings directing buyers to look on eBay. I agree, if the OP want to sell it, list it in the classifieds and sell it.

"Since Glyptal is what Ford originally used to seal the magneto coils................"
Shellac was originally used, its solubility in alcohols makes it easier to disassemble methanol soaked coils from the stator ring when doing a rebuild, and makes original mag ring coil insulation vulnerable to damage when alcohol blended fuel accumulates in the crankcase.

"Since Glyptal is what Ford originally used to seal the magneto coils................"

Here is the actual specification for the " clear insulating varnish" used by Ford, sure wasn't red insulating enamel!

and the details:

And the process of application at the factory for coating mag rings, a submerged coat under pressure, and two additional coats with heating to harden the varnish coats. With this quality application, no wonders that some mag rings are still good after 100 years :

Thanks Dan:

Do you have the full text of that specification? or the reference? My statement regarding use of shellac may not be correct for all years, but I still maintain the varnish was alcohol soluble. And apologies to Jiminbartow for extending his thread. jb

Jim

shellac is thinned or dissolved by alcohol. Varnish is impervious to alcohol.

I’m lucky enough to have an electrical motor rebuild shop in my area that rewind’s industrial motors. They have never charged me for coating and baking the coil assembly’s, they use a pressure vat to force the varnish into coils and and the coil assembly comes out great. You guys might want to check in your area.