MTFCA Forum

It is interesting that a person is looking for the perfect Model T, one the meets his unusual close standard. Nothing else will do for him. He wants the result of someone else's hard work and much time. He does not want to do any of this hard work or will not take the time to do so. That is his privilege, of course, but it sets him apart from most Model T owners and of those who have spent much time and effort to produce the car he wants. There might be an an original Model T the is so close to original that it might meet his standard. Those Ts are in private or museum collections and probably will seldom come on the market. When they do, they will probably be sold via auction. Any one who wants such T will then have the opportunity to bid for one. It will be very interesting when his sought after Mode T is found -as to where and how.

There are plenty of folks who are looking for a very specific or expensive T. They are generally "in the know" in the hobby, are very "unpublic" about their searching and are contacted to specifically make an offer by the owner or someone who knows the person seeking such a vehicle.

I'm pretty surprised that a public search is referred by someone who apparently knows that person well enough to know that "they don't want to do the hard work". That seems kind of harsh, though I doubt it is meant to be. Not everyone is capable of a complete restoration, be it due to limits on their own labor or the limit of their checkbook. That doesn't make them a lesser hobbyist.

Personally, I wish the person all the luck in the world on their quest.

If a T is found today to the standards that a perfectionist wants it will have to be one that’s been restored to todays standards which would be better than one that was built in Henry’s Fords day.
Original perfection wouldn’t be as good as what todays people think it should be. If they were to see one that would have come off a 1925 assembly line they would be in for a surprise. The runs in original paint jobs that’s survived wouldn’t do for Mr Perfection that’s described here. If they looked closer at the body details the surprise would be bigger.

I found the perfect Model T (for me), and yes, it was the result of someone else's hard work (and investment). I complained on these boards about the number of brass era cars modified with distributors, retro-fitted starters, painted non-original colors, etc., etc. A member of these boards approached me and offered to sell me his car, an older ground-up restoration meant to be original as possible. He apologized for the addition of Rockymountain brakes, saying I could remove them easily (if I wanted to live dangerously )

He had purchased the car from the man who restored it and toured some 10,000 miles with it, then he proceeded to put another 10,000 on it, the while keeping it nicely maintained by a professional restoration shop.

It's perfect for me, because it is a reasonably close to original restoration, and as a well-used example, allows me to tinker with it as opposed to doing a complete restoration. Since I bought her, Lizzy came down with a case of the "grey death" necessitating a complete driveline and rear axle overhaul which I greatly enjoyed doing. I keep her up as I continue to wear her out.

I have done "frame off" restorations, and frankly just don't burn with that hard, jewel-like flame anymore. (Nor do I have the time for it. I just wanna have fun !)

Many people do not have the time, skills, equipment, space, money or desire to rebuild an antique automobile. I'd say most people don't. It's often said that you can buy a restoration for less than you can perform one. Some people live in "old car deserts", where there are few, if any, other people nearby to network with, and few, if any, shops, "barns", or service supliers in the area. I'm glad there is a market for high-end restorations, and nice, if imperfect, cars that are in good condition and ready for use. They do come up for sale, for any number of reasons. Personally, I'm looking for a good, original, turn-key 1936 Packard V-12 roadster in deep midnight blue with a tan top and tan Corinthian leather interior. My budget is strictly limited to $10K.... I expect the car to be fully equipped with all period Packard accessories. Car must be within 500 miles of my location.

Pat, opt for a '37 with safety-flex IFS. It will ride and handle much better than the '36.

Don’t let the Forum fool you. There are a lot of T owners who don’t “tinker”. It’s their prerogative how they want to enjoy this hobby.

Andy

I find it interesting that the standard advice that antique and specialty vehicle owners give someone looking for an old car is "Buy the best one that you can afford", then when someone is trying to do just that, we criticize him for it.

No problem John. We criticize everyone for everything. It's part of the fun !!

It is a great thing that there are people who want to fork over big bucks to buy a readily restored car that some other 'tinkerer' invested sweat and money into, it provides the restorer with the dough he needs to invest in his next project, or to use as he sees fit, both are happy !
As a boon to the hobby it results in more cars being saved from the scrapper.

In today’s world you can buy one done cheaper than you can do one.

I do what I am capable and equipped to do, and leave such things as machine work to professionals. I do not enter any of my cars in contests where judging is involved nor shows where the entrant must pay for the privalige of being judged. I will enter in shows which cost me nothing and are not judged.
Many years ago, I "restored" a 1931 A Phaeton. I drove it from San Diego to San Francisco to an A club national tour. There were A's which left New York and drove across the country and picked up other groups as they crossed until they got to San Francisco. We parked in Golden Gate Park for a show and judging. The only cars which won prizes were local area cars which had been trailered in with no oil in crankcase and the engine was ground smooth and painted and polished like a mirror. The tops had no imperfect stitch nor showed any evidence of having ever been lowered and the tires still had the original bead in the center.
The only other car to win a prize was the one who drove the farthest to get there. From Florida.
I would rather use the car and if something needs repair then fix it. If it gets a ding, do some body work.
Norm

Norman Kling wrote: ↑

Mon May 30, 2022 11:03 am

I would rather use the car and if something needs repair then fix it . . .
Norm

So would I, Norm. Others find much gratification in having a flawless pearl in a velvet case. There are a few who seem to do both, and my hat's off to them ! I don't know how they do it !!

Dan Hatch wrote: ↑

Mon May 30, 2022 5:51 am

In today’s world you can buy one done cheaper than you can do one.

Unless you are buying a Duesenberg or a Bugatti, that has pretty much always been true.

I would own several dozen 100-point high end classic cars and display them on drive-on rotating glass turntables that would periodically rise from the floor to allow viewing the car from various elevations and inspection of the running gear. Outside my elegant display building, a scenic, closed driving course covering about 35 miles would offer an opportunity to drive the cars in a clean, pleasant setting free of traffic hazards, salt, washboards, dust, and so forth. A small, dedicated staff with a full suite of top-flight tools and equipment would see to the care of each vehicle and perform repairs and adjustments as needed. Another building will hold another few dozen cars of all sorts in various conditions, also with appropriate staff and facilities. Both leaded and unleaded fuel will be readily available on-site, along with non-odororized "white gasoline" such as was commonly available in the 1910-1928 era. Kerosene will be on hand for the steam vehicles. Specialized lubricants will be kept on hand. If my emails ever get through to Elon, I'm sure he will be eager to finance it all. PS: Elon, I'll even let you put your name on the fender protectors!

The only difference between a Trailer Queen and a Trophy Wife is their age. Both cost too much to maintain.

TXGOAT2 wrote: ↑

Mon May 30, 2022 12:23 pm

I would own several dozen 100-point high end classic cars and display them on drive-on rotating glass turntables that would periodically rise from the floor to allow viewing the car from various elevations and inspection of the running gear. Outside my elegant display building, a scenic, closed driving course covering about 35 miles would offer an opportunity to drive the cars in a clean, pleasant setting free of traffic hazards, salt, washboards, dust, and so forth. A small, dedicated staff with a full suite of top-flight tools and equipment would see to the care of each vehicle and perform repairs and adjustments as needed. Another building will hold another few dozen cars of all sorts in various conditions, also with appropriate staff and facilities. Both leaded and unleaded fuel will be readily available on-site, along with non-odororized "white gasoline" such as was commonly available in the 1910-1928 era. Kerosene will be on hand for the steam vehicles. Specialized lubricants will be kept on hand. If my emails ever get through to Elon, I'm sure he will be eager to finance it all. PS: Elon, I'll even let you put your name on the fender protectors!

I ran an American station in the 1970's and we still had "white" gas.

The Woodhead Ford collection that was sold some 10 years ago had the Fords possed to show of the features. The early ones had mirrors underneath. Ford ranged from 1903 A to 2003 thunderbird. A well stored 2 lever was part of the collection. Sorry to say, all were sold at auction.