MTFCA Forum

Desperate times and all that... Are any of the eBay, etc. aluminum radiators a drop-in for a low cowl Model T or at least close? I can work around the possible inlet/outlet mismatch and lack of proper filler. I just need something to hold water so I can drive my car.

Thanks,
Matt

I think Speedway Motors use to have one that was the right dimensions, as long as you can move the inlet and outlet.

Speedway Motors no longer has the T radiator for a Ford engine so the outlets will need moved. Jim Harwood put one in his car see the old forum June 19 2014. Modern radiators do not have the large tank so they have less coolant capacity, the cores are much thinner & may not thermosyphon well and may need a water pump ( did I type that out loud ) Modern radiators do not have the frame brace in the core so they may have the same issue as the old aftermarket honeycomb radiators with leaking in the lower corners. I run a International scout radiator in my speedster and slot the mount so the frame flexing does not pull on the core. Most well established radiator shops can install a suitable core in your tanks for about half the price of a new radiator. They seem to have better luck with a old honeycomb radiator . I was told they are made more like the modern ones are?
Craig.

Considering that you would only run the water about an inch over the core, except for some expansion, smaller upper tank should really not matter. You could install an overflow/expansion tank then run extra water if it is one with the filler cap under the hood and pressure type cap.

Aluminum Radiators sold for Model T's are for Bucket T's not Henry's Model T's. If you could get an aluminum core the same size as a T then how do you affix it the steel frame. Then if your successful with all your efforts, what do you have -- one that costs the same as a Brassworks.

Aside from the $950 price tag, Brassworks has a 21+ week lead time. I priced having mine recored and the quote was $700-$1000 - yes I am getting a second opinion. The aluminum radiators I have seen have ears sticking out the side, so mounting is not an issue. If I am successful with all my efforts, I will be driving my Model T this summer for around $300.

The replacement core is copper and brass. Not aluminum. Will work same as the original but will not have the brace. If the choice is made to pressurize
the cooling system using a water pump it would be necessary to run a Texas T pump I don't think packing will work good with a pressurized system.
Please let us know how it goes. I have a re-cored tall for my next project & a heavy duty fork truck radiator to use as a core for another.
Craig.

The replacement core is copper and brass. Not aluminum. Will work same as the original but will not have the brace. If the choice is made to pressurize
the cooling system using a water pump it would be necessary to run a Texas T pump I don't think packing will work good with a pressurized system.
Please let us know how it goes. I have a re-cored tall for my next project & a heavy duty fork truck radiator to use as a core for another.
Craig.

Here is one that did it
https://mtfca.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php? ... um#p190231

Nope that is never going to work! I say, if you can't get a proper T radiator (for your specific year and time of day your car was assembled) you should just forget driving it this summer and spend your time doing yard work. And if you pursue this, you will have to live with the shame of what you have done. Model Ts were NEVER repaired with "make do" parts that were just handy...only new parts that could be backed up with the proper paperwork. Seriously, if it means getting to have some fun with it, I'd give it a try. It's your car.

Randahl I'm not one to talk about correct model T's. I try to drive, share & show my T's. To say that model T's where only repaired with correct parts would be ignoring the fact that the model T bore forth the automotive aftermarket industry that lets us repair and get our cars without being raped by the manufactures. You did get it right it is his car. I suggest he enjoy it as much as he can.
Craig.

I can't find it now but there was a post on the old forum where someone modified a '65 Mustang radiator to fit a Model T. I don't know if he had a low or high radiator shell.

I just Googled "New Model T Ford radiators" and about a dozen came up, including a couple that were made from Aluminum. I don't know anything about either the quality or the lead times, but it might be worth checking with the suppliers.

A local member was just building a put together T with old parts that he acquired over the years that said he has several correct model Ts that are stunning. He just wanted something to do and have some fun & to see what the results were. He found an aluminum radiator that was a three row (most are 2 row, it makes a real difference). The 3 row came from eBay and was a little over $200 shipped. It did have the T style neck. I believe he had to move the bottom intake to the driver side & modified a radiator shroud to fit the radiator. It was only slightly wider & perhaps taller. He’s in his 70s and it didn’t take him long to do it. Surprisingly it worked very well. No water pump and ran cool. I’m not sure if he still has it but he may. Since then several folks in the club have done the same. That said we do have a member that is an expert in welding aluminum from his shipyard experience, just my 2 cents your mileage my vary.

Apis Mellifera wrote: ↑

Tue May 31, 2022 7:37 pm

Aside from the $950 price tag, Brassworks has a 21+ week lead time. I priced having mine recored and the quote was $700-$1000 - yes I am getting a second opinion. The aluminum radiators I have seen have ears sticking out the side, so mounting is not an issue. If I am successful with all my efforts, I will be driving my Model T this summer for around $300.

You may want to call Smith and Jones to ask if they have these radiators in stock. Both high and low. I bought one a few years ago for the 23 and it is still fine. Differences in construction from Ford, and Brassworks as not a true replica .

The inlet is centered unlike the slight off set of Ford, so the upper hose takes a bend. But it is USA made, flat tube, and fit the frame ok, no center bar across the bottom of the core, but sure better than a worn out steam making radiator!

I was just thinking the other day that we may be luck that a new T radiator (black) is around $850. I called and asked about getting a 1963 Chevrolet pickup radiator recored at a local shop and they wanted around $700. I could only find one shop that even works on radiators.
I talked to a man today about 30 miles from me that a friend used. He told me that manufacturers had quit making cores (copper and brass) because of material costs or something COVID related. He said he’s been working on radiators for 50 years and now has a shop by his house. I’m about to take him that truck radiator and a couple T radiators and as long as they don’t leak I’ll be happy.
If you could find somebody that knows what they’re doing they might could make you something that would work. My friend went there and got a radiator made for this speedster/hot rod or whatever he’s building on a homemade frame with a flathead V8 and a Model A radiator shell. The guy had the parts just laying around and charged him around $100 a couple years ago. Most of the places I called didn’t act like they had a clue about fixing a radiator, they just had new ones.

The guys that repair radiators are getting older and retiring. The last two I dealt with have both closed up shop. I currently know of a couple of shops in the Detroit area that still do the work. About a two hour drive for me.

Bergs radiator is for sale....it would be nice if some enterprising younger fella' would buy it and continue the business.

Corey,
You can buy a new aluminum radiator that is a direct fit for your Chevy for under $300! And yes it would be nice if someone bought out Bergs but most of us are trying to not flunk retirement. I have had some luck with radiator companies that do commercial radiators. Big mining equipment ( trucks & generators still use brass & copper radiators) so there guys know how to do them.
Craig.

And at this rate...., you will be buying motorcycle tires for your 16, 17, 18, 19, 20 and 21 inch rims! Everyone wants to hold back until it is too late, now it becomes scarce all of sudden everyone wants. Sounds familiar..., head gaskets!

Just Sayin'.., You must support vendors or they shut the doors and sell off. I did!

Hank

Craig Leach wrote: ↑

Wed Jun 01, 2022 12:01 am

Randahl I'm not one to talk about correct model T's. I try to drive, share & show my T's. To say that model T's where only repaired with correct parts would be ignoring the fact that the model T bore forth the automotive aftermarket industry that lets us repair and get our cars without being raped by the manufactures. You did get it right it is his car. I suggest he enjoy it as much as he can.
Craig.

No worries... of course you are correct. I wasn't serious about any of what I said, except the part about doing what he wants. I should have wrote it in my sarcastic voice. Ha!

Randel,
I try not to take anyone to seriously I'm in the hobby for the fun of it if it gets to serious I'll go back to hotrods they seem to be more forgiving. None of my cars are real correct but run well & get out quite a bit ( not as much as I would like) there is more than one way to skin a cat so if we help each other out we will be able to enjoy the hobby with more comradery and for less cost & effort. none of us are getting younger or healthier.
Craig.

I got the second quote on a recore and it was $600. That's close enough to a new one from Brassworks. In the meantime, I had all but settled on buying this one:

https://www.speedwaymotors.com/1917-192 ... 91015600-B

While up at our farm yesterday, I decided to ask my uncle, who has several Model Ts and lives next door, if he had any radiators that held water. High on a shelf behind two brass radiators was an old non-Ford low radiator with a honeycomb core. I took home one of the brass ones and the black one. Both look like they'll get me driving. So, if you see a cobbled-together '22 out an about this summer, hopefully a period non-Ford honeycomb radiator isn't as offensive as a new aluminum one and perhaps you can bear to wave.

Many thanks for the suggestions. They are very helpful to this new and very green Model T owner.

Apis Mellifera wrote: ↑

Thu Jun 02, 2022 10:23 am

I got the second quote on a recore and it was $600. That's close enough to a new one from Brassworks. In the meantime, I had all but settled on buying this one:

https://www.speedwaymotors.com/1917-192 ... 91015600-B

While up at our farm yesterday, I decided to ask my uncle, who has several Model Ts and lives next door, if he had any radiators that held water. High on a shelf behind two brass radiators was an old non-Ford low radiator with a honeycomb core. I took home one of the brass ones and the black one. Both look like they'll get me driving. So, if you see a cobbled-together '22 out an about this summer, hopefully a period non-Ford honeycomb radiator isn't as offensive as a new aluminum one and perhaps you can bear to wave.

Many thanks for the suggestions. They are very helpful to this new and very green Model T owner.

Two comments - Both outlets on the Aluminum radiator that you linked will have to be moved, so there goes any warranty. Second, remember that just because a radiator does not leak doesn't mean that it is any good. I have a T radiator "down the barn" that doesn't leak. It also doesn't cool. I do wish you luck, however.

Western Honey Bee? Interesting user name....I suspect there is a story behind it.

Cooling issues have long been the bane of Model T owners. Look at the number of water pumps sold back in the day. Unfortunately, without a workable cooling system you're going to have an unreliable car, not one you could trust on a tour on a hot day. I bit the bullet and bought a Berg's flat-tube radiator and have never had an overheating problem. Even with all seats filled in hilly country on a 90°plus day. Obviously you need to keep within a budget but I'd suggest you start saving up for a new brassworks radiator....spending money on dubious solutions is money you might wish you had later. Meanwhile, I hope you find something to at least get you running.

While the mounting ears would have to be lowered, overflow tank added and a fake neck added, only the top inlet would have to be moved or "S" shaped inlet hose gotten; https://www.ebay.com/itm/224975922091
At least the outlet is on the correct side.

I have had a lot of success with my aluminum radiator, give me a holler if you decided to get one and I'll let you know what I did to make it work.just shoot me an email at my email address below.

Mark

That radiator states it can be picked up in Azusa, CA. Looked it up and that is just a few miles west of Pasadena. Maybe one of our California members can check the place out. He has a 100% rating, but has only sold 15 items. Wonder if it is legit?

Jonah,
Maybe you can start a new post and let us know what you did???

"Based in China, coolingsystem has been an eBay member since Mar 07, 2021" More than likely, most all of them are made in China anyway.
Feedback looks ok it and does show local pickup so must have a warehouse in that location. I think that listing does at least give some dimensions, so that is a plus.

Well, my idea of using the free low cowl radiator did not hold water because the free low cowl radiator did not hold water. The brass one is on now and appears to be water tight. The next test will be to see if it actually cools. Of course, that will have to wait because the water connection on the head is different. Something likely obvious to most of you, I'm sure. It is now obvious to me too. I may end up running an aluminum radiator yet. Lang's said September...maybe... on a new one.

My 2 Cents on the Ebay aluminum one----which is probably the same as the Speedway one.

Problem 1, The upper tank is shaped wrong so a original shell does not fit correctly. Than means cutting it apart and rewelding. These rads are meant NOT to have the grill shell on them. They are meant for T-bucket style rods---thus the offering of polished tanks.

Problem 2, the lower tank is to tall, and needs reshaping also. the bottom corners of the tank hits the sides of the crossmember and front spring mount. Again, cut and reweld.

Problem 3, the obvious inlets and outlets need to be moved / modified.

Problem 4, the cap neck also needs to be moved---you can buy this rad without the neck and buy the neck seperate and place where needed.

Problem 5, If you have a low style rad, this isn't going to work, it is basically a high style.

Problem 6, The mount brackets are in the wrong spot....again, cut off and reweld.

Problem 7, it is a little narrower than the grill shell, so the shell is a little tricky to fit and get centered

After you get through all of that, you may have a possible candidate for it to work. I know, I tried, I have one here in the box still. I was looking for a cheap alternative myself. If you can cut and weld aluminum, could be a fun project. I was lucky enough to come across a decent original style copper brass one for $100.....then I found a low cowl roadster body for my Gow Job and had to start all over again......and again I got super lucky on finding a decent used low copper/brass for very little money.

My two cents on what it takes to use an aluminum radiator ,all I did is move the output and input spouts andmove the mounting tabs lower, and put on a dowel attach to the steel rod to attach the cowel.
And I learned how to weld aluminum that day too! A man at my church is a professional welder and was able to teach me.

Found a new low cowl radiator ready to ship. Should be here in two days! Many thanks for the comments, suggestions, etc.

Jonah D'Avella wrote: ↑

Fri Jun 03, 2022 8:09 am

My two cents on what it takes to use an aluminum radiator ,all I did is move the output and input spouts andmove the mounting tabs lower, and put on a dowel attach to the steel rod to attach the cowel.
And I learned how to weld aluminum that day too! A man at my church is a professional welder and was able to teach me.

Jonah, I mean no disrespect or doubt to your success, but I am curious as to the fit of your grill shell and hood with the body. As I saw it on mine, there was no possible way that could be installed with just those mods you say you did AND have the grill shell and hood fit correctly. Again, if it worked for you that's great and I am happy for you---consider it a lucky scenario. You might not be as picky as I was, just my observations with the one I purchased, the fit issues were glaringly obvious.

I may still move forward with modifying mine so I guess it could be a spare if my original honeycomb gives out. I have a TIG welder so for me it's just a matter of dedicating the time. It would be cost prohibitive to do it for someone else.