MTFCA Forum

I have a 1922 model T touring I have a question
The front passenger door rubs and sticks out at the bottom the fire wall rubs the back of the motor. Does the firewall bracket go on the inside or the outside of the firewall?
Which one goes on the left or right? I bought a new hinge thinking that was it but it did not help any.
Thanks in advance
Mark,

You may be using the wrong firewall brackets. Some are for wood firewalls and some are for steel firewalls. Here is an earlier post about the differences. Check out the comparison photo and information.
https://www.mtfca.com/discus/messages/3 ... 36045.html

The pictures look like the ones I have I guess I will have to take them out to see if the tape measure lines up with the holes. I have the brackets on the engine side so it shouldn’t be to hard to remove.
Thanks,

One of the pictures show a wood spacer between the bracket and the firewall is this correct? I do not have a spacer between mine.
Thanks,

The difference is one type is more backset more than the other. The mounting holes are the same. It’s the backset that’s the difference. The backset is made to accommodate the wood firewall since it’s thicker the the flat steel firewall.

There should be no wood spacers in a correct set-up.If there are some fitted, it is probably to make up the difference in thickness between a wooden firewall and a steel one.
As others have said, the holes in the frame are the same for both types of brackets. The holes for the bolts that fix the firewall to the brackets are the same. The difference is in the off-set of the bracket face that goes to the firewall.
The door not fitting in the hole is a different problem. It will require the door to be twisted in where it hangs out. Some have success by fitting a turnbuckle across the wooden frame and adjusting that. A better way is to fit a twist bar. A piece of 1/8" x 2" wide flat steel is cut to the width of the door, two screws at each end hold the bar in place. That bar is twisted so that when the screws are tightened the door is pulled into shape to better fit the doorway in the body. The neatest way to fit the bar is to rebate it flush in the wooden frame and countersink the screws in the twist bar.

Hope this helps.
Allan from down under.

Mark

if you will read the text of the original question on the link provided, you will see that the gentleman with the wood block/spacers was having trouble getting things to line up. Do not use that picture as an example of anything but a problem looking for a solution. That link was provided solely to show you, as John K said above, that different brackets have different back-sets depending on if it was used with a wood, or a thin metal firewall.

Your door fit is an entirely different subject, entailing entirely different cause(s) and fix(es)

After you resolve your firewall bracket issue, you should pursue the door problem on a new thread. Mixing the two issues here will lead to untold problems keeping track of one or the other

best of luck to a speedy resolution, and of course, welcome to the Forum

It is possible that the chassis has sagged on the right side. The torque of the engine and the pull on the driveshaft with the transmission brake can twist the engine in that direction. This combined with possible bumps of the axle against the radius rod all contribute to a sag on that side. So check this out. Also deteriorated wood in the body and door can also cause a problem.
I am not saying that it isn't the wrong brackets, but it could be caused by any or a combination of these things. These problems could also cause a problem with the alignment of the hood with the radiator and the body. If the hood does not fit straight, this could also be a symptom.
some pictures of your car might help with the diagnosis.
Norm

I am trying to figure out how to attach photos to the post. All good info here I will check it all out.
Thanks,

Hope this turns out.
Thanks,

The first photo shows a hood shelf with the dogleg at the back end. This normally indicates a high radiator car. In turn, does this mean that the firewall is necessarily a steel firewall. The change from wood to steel occurred with the last of the lo radiators.
Or have I missed something in translation?

Allan from down under.

Mark

that's a start

be a little more generous with the camera pixels and show us where the back of the motor rubs the firewall

from your bracket pictures, things look fine...the engine does sit very close to the firewall on these cars and maybe all you need to do is give the firewall a bit of a tug at the bottom to pull it off of the back of the head.

overall shots of the car will help folks too. Front, rear, side, interior...Like Alan said, you have shown us enough to think your car may actually be a '24 (regardless of what the title says...). This will all add up to better advice.

It does have a metal fire wall. The car was my dads I inherited
When he passed as far back as I can remember it had the metal firewall but I donor remember it rubbing. The car was in peices when I got it I put it together like a puzzle.
Thanks,

p
Here are some pictures of what I am working with.
Thanks again for all the help.

It's not uncommon for the firewall to rub the back of the engine. Also, not uncommon for the door to poke out as yours does. The body and the door are made with wooden framing, covered by sheet metal. As such, the wooden framing sometimes loosens up and distorts with age. Your issue may be that the door has a warp in it, or that the body has spread open a bit, meaning that the dimension from the right-side armrest to the left-side armrest has widened with age. The amount that your door hangs open at the bottom is somewhat minor compared to many I've seen.

I wouldn’t worry about the door. When T’s came out from the factory they weren’t extremely precise automobiles. As fast as they were moving them out the door overall they did pretty well.
These days when we restore them we build them back better than they were originally were.
The reason why is we take our time with them and not working at assembly line speed.

When I restored my 24 Coupe I bought a really nice original deck lid with excellent original wood. When repainting it and starting to install it I soon found out why it didn’t fit exactly right. It was 3/8” out of square! I did install it but it was a lesson in Fords factory standards.

Looking at the front view of your T it looks like the hood is a bit higher from the radiator on the left side (driver's side). I think that the chassis might be sagging on the right side. Hard to tell for sure because it is parked on a crowned road. You can block up the front of the body by putting a piece of an old tire between the body blocks at the bolts on that side and it might correct the problem. You will need to start at the front and get the hood to fit right and then adjust in the center to fit the door and finally the back door. It will take some experimenting because any change in one location will effect the other locations. Park on a flat surface when you do these adjustments.
Norm

With a little more checking the right side is sagging I am trying to figure a way to correct the sagging. If I push a little on the windshield frame the door closes fine and does not rub. The body blocks is that the blocks in the frame? The only other blocks that I can think of are the blocks under the running boards.
Thanks again it helps a lot.
Mark

Tbuff23 wrote: ↑

Thu Dec 08, 2022 9:57 pm

With a little more checking the right side is sagging I am trying to figure a way to correct the sagging. If I push a little on the windshield frame the door closes fine and does not rub. The body blocks is that the blocks in the frame? The only other blocks that I can think of are the blocks under the running boards.
Thanks again it helps a lot.
Mark

He's basically saying that you can put shims between the frame and the body to correct the sag.

I have aligned the door with a piano wire and a screen door turnbuckle. Pull the door panel off and put the wire between the top corner close to the windshield and the lower right corner . Put the turnbuckle in the middle where it does not contact the wood and snug it up. It will pull the corner back in. The wood has loosened and relaxed.