MTFCA Forum

This has happened to me twice now and I'm at a loss what is incorrect on a starter when the balance ring/counter weight hits the flywheel
with enough force to break it? I have one starter that has had a spacer installed on he shaft to prevent this ( I assume ) This starter doesn't
have excessive end play. The pinion is twice as long as the ring gear so I would think there should be something to prevent this from
happening? I would be grateful for any ideas. Thanks.
Craig.

That is one beat up bendix gear!!

are you running 12V ?

Hi Scott,
Yes I'm running 12 volt but this starter has done this on 6 volt also. I use the lowest CCA battery I can find. and I change the spring, bolts & key
every year. And have not had any issues other than this. Thanks.
Craig.

Look at the flywheel. Bet it matches the bendix gear.

The starter needs a full rebuild. Then operate it on 6 volts.

Some thoughts,

- How much endplay do you have in your crankshaft/flywheel?
- How much endplay in you starter shaft?
- Maybe leave out the gasket between the starter and hogshead, using only sealant.
- Check out the face of your ring gear for burrs that may be hitting the balance ring.
- Are you using the correct bendix spring and is it stretched out? The wrong spring may cause the Bendix spring to elongate under load and drive the gear into your ring gear. By wrong spring, I mean one that's wound in the wrong direction, like maybe one from a Model A.

Hi Guys,
I would rather not go into the 12volt vs 6 volt thing. I have accessories that run on 12 volt so my mind is made up on that one! I have seen
this on 6 volt systems also so that argument doesn't hold water with me. The flywheel has a matching mark all the way around it. The
crank has .006 endplay (Great gasp everyone but it has no magneto so its OK) the starter has maybe .002 endplay. So I checked all the
starters that I have out and found some interesting things. most of the starters have a shoulder that the Bendix abuts so it can only go
so far on the shaft ( one did not have that ) two others this abutment allows the gear to hit the end of the starter nose. This seems to
very as much as an 1/4 of an inch. Way more than armature spacing will make up for. This also allows the spring to stretch enough to
disengage the drive head if worn to much. There appears no info on what these measurements are supposed to be. Many starter gears
are replaced because the counter weight is loose and many are brazed & welded up when they are loose. This part is not designed to be
a travel stop for the drive. The stop nut is! I have found these issues on starters that never seen 12 volts so maybe this is more of a
comedy of errors so we should pay more attention to details on the final assembly than the voltage. Model A starter springs are wound
the same direction as model Ts are as far as I can tell. And the spring length on the spring I took out is only .015 longer than the new one
I just got from a reputable supplier. Also the gear length of the ones I have differ as much as .050. I'm not saying that 12 volts is not a
greater load on parts I just wonder how much blame we put on is the lack of checking & maintenance. And we blame it on 6 more volts.
Craig.

Maybe, if you posted some photos of your entire Bendix something might jump out to us.

(BTW, yes, you're correct about the Model A springs. Don't know why I have that stuck in my mind. Thanks.)

Jerry,
On the spring thing. That is a wide held belief I think it comes from the 8 & 9N tractor starters that if I remember correctly looks the same but
turns the opposite direction? I'm not game to take apart four starters for that. I need to get my grandsons truck running. 2 neighbors tractors
running, trim trees before its to late in the year & help paint a barn! So I have time to finish my projects. Retirement is a lot of work isn't it?
Craig.

Is your ring gear installed backwards?

I know its money, but why don't you buy one of the Model T starters that has been converted to 12 volts that are advertised here in the parts classifieds? If it does the same this with a starter running the proper voltage, you've got flywheel or troubles, elsewhere. I know you say this is the only trouble that you've had running 12 volts. You are lucky. Once, when running 12 volts through my 6 volt starter, I had a Bendix gear shoot of the end of the starter motor shaft, with such force, it hit the Bendix cover, opposite the starter motor; broke all four screws attaching it to the hogshead; and the cover shot across my garage 20 feet1

Terry, if you wrote a paper on that, you might be credited with the development of the first practical fusion reactor...it sounds like you got out a lot more energy from that thing than was put into it!!

Hi Adam,
Ring gear is on correctly.
Terry,
That is one of the reasons why I replace the Key, bolts & spring every year. I have found them in poor shape before, even on the ones that
have never seen 12 volts.
Someday I will set down and convert all of them to 12 volt at one time.
Craig.