Question regarding details of top installation on my '13 Touring

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Darren J Wallace
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Question regarding details of top installation on my '13 Touring

Post by Darren J Wallace » Sat May 25, 2019 9:04 pm

I'm installing a new top on my early Canadian '13. It had a new top sometime in the past and the original "top covering" was still on the bows up until today. Because of the amount of tack holes in the wood needing plugging, I decided it was best to replace the front bow top material covering.
As far as I can tell, this top never had the front flap installed that takes up the space between the top and the windshield. I remember when I was a kid when this car still had it's original top, and there was no flap then either. In fact there was a rear view mirror installed on the inside of the top front bow. Only screw holes remain of that accessory.
The top assembly on my car seems to be more of a "1912" style, but it did have a '13 rear window according to my photos. The locating sockets that lock the top assembly together when it's down indicates a "1912" style top sockets.
Did all '12's and '13's from the factory have this top flap?
Thanks for any input!
1913 Canadian Touring & 1905 Queen, both cars are 4 generation family owned cars

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Re: Question regarding details of top installation on my '13 Touring

Post by Darren J Wallace » Sat May 25, 2019 9:07 pm

In this picture of the car from 1912, you can see fairly clearly there was no flap. I see the top straps running right to the front bow. Even though the car is 16 years old in this picture, what are the chances that piece was removed?
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13 T in 1929 wedding of Louise Sippel and Farrell B Kinnaman in Cleveland Ohio.jpg
1913 Canadian Touring & 1905 Queen, both cars are 4 generation family owned cars

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Re: Question regarding details of top installation on my '13 Touring

Post by Darren J Wallace » Sat May 25, 2019 9:07 pm

Darren J Wallace wrote:
Sat May 25, 2019 9:07 pm
In this picture of the car from 1929, you can see fairly clearly there was no flap. I see the top straps running right to the front bow. Even though the car is 16 years old in this picture, what are the chances that piece was removed?
1913 Canadian Touring & 1905 Queen, both cars are 4 generation family owned cars

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Darren J Wallace
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Re: Question regarding details of top installation on my '13 Touring

Post by Darren J Wallace » Sat May 25, 2019 9:08 pm

This photo from 1989 shows the original rear window
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1913 T in 1989.jpg
1913 Canadian Touring & 1905 Queen, both cars are 4 generation family owned cars

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Re: Question regarding details of top installation on my '13 Touring

Post by Darren J Wallace » Sat May 25, 2019 9:14 pm

Here are the top sockets locating bushings for lack of a better description, they're quite thin, and not like later ones which are much fatter looking, and the original material over the front bow if this helps.
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IMG_5616.JPG
IMG_5616a.jpg
1913 Canadian Touring & 1905 Queen, both cars are 4 generation family owned cars


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Re: Question regarding details of top installation on my '13 Touring

Post by Colin Mavins » Sun May 26, 2019 10:05 am

Hello my late 12 Canadian car does not have the flap and never did , the original top was replaced in 1967. The original top is in the garage in a box.
28.jpg
4.jpg


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Re: Question regarding details of top installation on my '13 Touring

Post by Original Smith » Sun May 26, 2019 10:50 am

Don't forget, the front bow doesn't use bow drill. It uses top material, and MUST be installed on the bias. It is really a job to get it right, and uses quite a bit of material. I've found a heat gun, and contact cement help a lot. Expect sore fingers too. Next, I can't imagine your car having a rear window as small as the one in the old photo.

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Re: Question regarding details of top installation on my '13 Touring

Post by KWTownsend » Sun May 26, 2019 12:31 pm

Darren-
As other have said, there is no windshield "flap" for 1913. And I understand and appreciate the fact you are tying to do an authentic restoration of your family heirloom. However, there is no reason that you could not fabricate a removeable windshield flap. I have considered it for my Oct-Nov, 1911 car, but to date has not come to fruition.

Think of it as a front side curtain.

My vision was to create a piece that attaches near the front bow corners using the existing Murphy Fasteners for the side curtains. If used along with the side curtains, the original fasteners would have to be swapped out for "double height" type. My thought was to possibly use side curtain windshield clips to attach it to the sides of the windshield (if needed). For the center part along the front bow, I don't know if a solid piece of steel flat bar stitched inside of the flap would suffice for rigidity or if a secondary attachment point on the bow would be needed. Maybe a snap or Murphy Fastener or two would work, but then, of course, you are "adding extra stuff"

If you make one, let me know how it works out and maybe I will make one for myself!

By the way, I love the rear section of after market side curtains in your 1929 photo.

: ^ )

Keith

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Re: Question regarding details of top installation on my '13 Touring

Post by Darren J Wallace » Sun May 26, 2019 4:20 pm

Thanks guys for your input! I'm going to leave it off but may take Keith's advise and see if it can me made "removable" without messing up the rest too much.
Larry, thankfully, Clastique's great top kit has a better sized window! Everything is going fairly well and yes, I have no finger pads left!
Attachments
IMG_5626.JPG
IMG_5625.JPG
1913 Canadian Touring & 1905 Queen, both cars are 4 generation family owned cars

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Re: Question regarding details of top installation on my '13 Touring

Post by Darren J Wallace » Sun May 26, 2019 4:21 pm

More pics from today's work
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IMG_5630.JPG
IMG_5629.JPG
IMG_5628.JPG
IMG_5627.JPG
1913 Canadian Touring & 1905 Queen, both cars are 4 generation family owned cars

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Re: Question regarding details of top installation on my '13 Touring

Post by Darren J Wallace » Sun May 26, 2019 4:26 pm

Had to correct the top pad on the driver's side, the pic was taken before I did that. These project require a gazillion checks and rechecks. So far, all the dimensions are really good. I've been using a pictorial guide from Royce Peterson's website and it's been a huge help, with a lot of time saving suggestions! This is the third top I've installed in 20 years, but this one is going a little easier thanks to what I've learned previously from my past mistakes :)
1913 Canadian Touring & 1905 Queen, both cars are 4 generation family owned cars

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Darren J Wallace
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Re: Question regarding details of top installation on my '13 Touring

Post by Darren J Wallace » Sun May 26, 2019 4:27 pm

Darren J Wallace wrote:
Sun May 26, 2019 4:26 pm
Had to correct the top pad on the driver's side, the pic was taken before I did that. These projects require a gazillion checks and rechecks. So far, all the dimensions are really good. I've been using a pictorial guide from Royce Peterson's website and it's been a huge help, with a lot of time saving suggestions! This is the third top I've installed in 20 years, but this one is going a little easier thanks to what I've learned previously from my past mistakes :)
1913 Canadian Touring & 1905 Queen, both cars are 4 generation family owned cars

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Re: Question regarding details of top installation on my '13 Touring

Post by Darren J Wallace » Sun May 26, 2019 4:30 pm

Much better now!
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IMG_5631.JPG
1913 Canadian Touring & 1905 Queen, both cars are 4 generation family owned cars

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Re: Question regarding details of top installation on my '13 Touring

Post by Darren J Wallace » Sun May 26, 2019 4:34 pm

Thanks again everyone! I still have all the original side curtains including the ones in the old picture, but they're only good for copying. They're pretty beat up and petrified. That's a project for another winter!
1913 Canadian Touring & 1905 Queen, both cars are 4 generation family owned cars

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Re: Question regarding details of top installation on my '13 Touring

Post by Darren J Wallace » Tue May 28, 2019 5:48 pm

A little more progress....too cold to tack to the bows. Classtique left the Murphy fasteners off of the bottom row so I could match them to the car's original fastener positions. I wonder why they put them on in such a manner?
Attachments
IMG_5639.JPG
IMG_5636.JPG
IMG_5635.JPG
1913 Canadian Touring & 1905 Queen, both cars are 4 generation family owned cars

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