MTFCA Forum

Attached are the starting positions

Any snow in the area?

Wind rain cold

Looks like everyone made it thru the first day.

Day 2

Day 3
Unofficial results
Pending tear down

Looks like the weather pushed down average speeds... it's below average here today, but hardly cold!

OFFICIAL RESULTS
1ST place dq ed due to cyl head volume under min
Every one moved up 1 position in standings
Ed Wright winner

And who might that have been ????????

A bit different to see a pickup with the full metal tray and fitted with wooden wheels being the winner. Well done. When was the last time a car won with wooden wheels?

I don't know. I will have to ask people who have been around longer than me. The last 3 years only one other person has ran wood wheels.

Kirk,
Thank you for posting this. It brings back fond memories.

Looking at the results page, I see a number of longtime regulars for the Montana race not there?

Wood wheels,
Thinking, Dennis Dakan

The person was DQ'ed because of a modified head? High Com? Lower Com? What was the part that got him dq?

Will, I have never participated in the Montana race, however I have followed it from a distance for many years. The rules are VERY strict! The model T mechanically must be basically factory stock! With minor a few allowed minor modifications like one piece valves and I believe aluminum pistons. Many parts can be a mixture of years. I believe that 1926/'27 wire wheels and rear end with better brakes can be used on earlier cars? And earlier higher compression heads can be used on later cars. However, other higher compression heads, high compression pistons, and shaving of the head more than a small amount (enough to clean up minor warpage) are forbidden!
The winning car MUST submit to a teardown for full inspection to make certain none of the forbidden modifications had been done. The list of things they check is quite long. Cars can, will, and have been, disqualified for many minor alterations. Even things like smoothing and oversizing of the carburetor or intake pathways can DQ a car. The rules are very explicit about the maximum sizing for those things.

Thanks Wayne

Thanks so much Tim
The last times I saw Dennis' car was either in Spokane in 2021 or McPherson in 2020 or up in your neck of woods in 2015.
But I still don't remember the wheels, but I do remember Dennis did win the 2005 Montana 500.

Will here is an excerpt from the Montana 500 rules,

2.5.5.Cylinder Head. Any cast iron original Ford script flat head (low or high) can be used.
2.5.5.1. The head can be milled, but the combustion chambers are limited to 270 cubic
centimeters minimum each.
2.5.5.1.1. Measure the combustion chamber volumes without head gasket or spark
plug. Fill the spark plug hole flush with modeling clay.
2.5.5.1.2. One combustion chamber cannot be modified.
2.5.5.2. Do not add material to any combustion chamber.

The combustion chamber volume in cylinder number 2 was less than 265 cc.
Therefore the first place car was disqualified.

Thanks for the answer, I assume that must have been an over sight on the builder, I cant believe for a moment that they would drive 500 miles in a Model T just to get disqualified. That must have been unbelievably embarrassing at the tear down. Maybe someday I will be rich enough to enter a car into that race. How many cars started and what broke for them to not be able to complete the race? I would assume that the little T engine could not take that high RPM stress for very long. I would guess that there were new balanced cranks, New cams, The pistons perfectly balanced with the crankshaft. Must have been a lot of work to make the engine strong enough for the trip.

So when they tear down your car, pull the head off, do they put it back together for you or is it like a secondary inspection crossing the border?

14 cars started, 12 finished.
For more detail, go to website mt500.run

Must be original Ford script crankshaft.
New camshaft and pistons OK.
For complete explanation, click on Rules at mt500.run.
Balancing a must for longevity.

Winning car is reassembled and driven out of shop after teardown and inspection.

After Jerome was disqualified, was Ed’s car tore down?

You can't use a counterweighted crankshaft in the Montana 500. No oil pumps, no insert bearings, transmission must be stock. My car competed (under previous ownership) in more than one Montana 500 and placed very well. It ran great when I got it, and 15,000 miles later, it still runs great. I've had some minor ignition problems, but no other issues other than the tires are in need of replacement now. If you start with a T in good condition and take reasonable care of it, it will give dependable service for a long time.

Sure would like to have that car back.

The only problems I've had is one set of points that lost a contact, which caused timer issues, and I've had one flat and worn two tires to the cord, and the rest are getting pretty well worn. The tires have held up very well, and I plan to replace with the same brand and size. The inner tubes do lose air over a week or ten days, so better tubes might be worthwhile. I got a 1927 style pressed steel headlight bar and adapted it to fit with the '26 lights. 1/2 " spacers (shaft collars) under the '26 headlight stands allows bolting them to the top side of the '27 bar mounts using longer carriage bolts. I have to drive on dirt roads for at least 6 miles every trip out, and I wanted the extra bracing for the front fenders. Putting a restriction in the Texas T oiler line stopped the smoking at idle. As far as I can tell, the rods and mains are still tight, and oil leakage is very minimal. The bands have not needed adjustment. Since adjusting the coils with an ECCT, rather than by ear, I've had no timer issues. The paint has held up great, with only 1 chip that I know of and some wear at the center hood hinge.

My Son and I had a blast in our coupe.
We were lucky enough to stay drier and warmer than most.
This is the 4th year, I have " "competed" " and Completed the endurance run.
For me, the Model T is not the reason, but the excuse the meet and make Friends.
I want to thank everyone who make this event possible.

This event is a great example to show how durable and dependable the T can be when given the attention to details of the engine and transmission including the whole car.
Kirk, you've never came in first but always finished with a smile on your face and pride in your sole being a winner every time!

I've always loved that event every time I've had to chance to compete against some of the best running T's in the country at wide open throttle for over 500 miles with the most amazing scenery anywhere!

Thanks for your posting

Gene
Thanks for inviting me up to the MT500 in 2019. I drove straight up I 25 with the intention of only observing and wound up doing data entry for the endurance run.
With all the encouragement I received from you and the other participants, my coupe went from pictured below to the smiles you mentioned pictured above.

Your Friend
Kirk

Thank you Kirk for the status updates and for sharing you experiences with the Montana 500. Great stories.

Kirk,
Wish I still had contact info for Dennis as I'm sure his car had wood wheels and he could answer your question.
Best Tim.

Mike Kosser
Thank you for all your contributionS to the Model T hobby.

The first thing I did after completing my first MT500 was to reinstall my I-Timer for "off the shelf" accuracy and maintenance free performance.
The second thing I did was reinstall the fan.
The third thing I did was decrease the air pressure in the tires.
I am then ready for my everyday driving and touring.

Tim Pearson
Let me check and see if I can find Dennis' info.

This is Eddie I am the one that won the 500. I still can't believe I did it. If you been thinking about doing this I would strongly suggest to doing it. It is a lot of fun and a lot of good people. If you need help everybody there will be glad to give you a hand. And I love my wood wheels love the looks of them. There are all new spokes. Come join us next year.

Eddie, With some side curtains and a tonneau cover for the bed, which might be allowed, maybe you'd top that 55 MPH average !?!?

Congrats on a great run.