New gasoline shut off valve sticking?

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bobt
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New gasoline shut off valve sticking?

Post by bobt » Sat Oct 26, 2019 10:56 am

I bought a fuel shut off valve that mounts to the carb from Eckler's so I don't have to crawl under my 1915 touring to turn the gas off. The problem I'm having is the valve is getting harder and harder to turn. I now have to use pliers to shut the valve. Is anybody else having this problem or do I have a defective valve? I took it off and polished the guts and put some grease on it and it worked GREAT for three days and now its seizing up again. HELP! bobt

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George Mills
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Re: New gasoline shut off valve sticking?

Post by George Mills » Sat Oct 26, 2019 11:03 am

I like the way that they look and the way that they work...but as you have found out, they do leave something to be desired after a while.

I've had similar experience with that valve and in one car, the solution was really quite simple...lift UP while you turn the handle and then press DOWN when you get it where you want it. You don't feel it move up and down, but it apparently does just enough.

That would say to me the lower spring is too strong causing too much friction and while I have thought of annealing one a bit and trying again, have never gotten around to it. The lift/turn/press down works too easy...lol

Try it, may or may not work for you...at least it saves plier marks...

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RajoRacer
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Re: New gasoline shut off valve sticking?

Post by RajoRacer » Sat Oct 26, 2019 11:46 am

There are 2 styles currently available - sounds as though you have the "less expensive" version which are known for the issue you are dealing with - the other "more expensive" one is actually designed after the Ford original style petcock which the "spring loading" works better the way George described - ever so slightly lift up while turning then gently push down to prevent any weeping.

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ABoer
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Re: New gasoline shut off valve sticking?

Post by ABoer » Sat Oct 26, 2019 3:13 pm

I use this one , I know it is not Original , but it works for me .
Toon
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Re: New gasoline shut off valve sticking?

Post by Scott_Conger » Sat Oct 26, 2019 3:37 pm

Well, polishing is really the one thing you don't want to do. There are now no micro-grooves for any lubricant to hide in and help you.

As Steve Tomaso stated above, I too have found that lifting slightly will compress the tension spring on the underside and the valve can be moved readily.
Last edited by Scott_Conger on Sat Oct 26, 2019 4:12 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Scott Conger

Full Flow Float Valves - deliver fuel like Henry intended!

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Re: New gasoline shut off valve sticking?

Post by Steve Jelf » Sat Oct 26, 2019 4:04 pm

I had the less expensive one and got rid of it because I needed a wrench to turn it, and I didn't care for the modern look. Rather than replace it with the costly one, I adopted an idea I saw on a TT and applied it to both my T's. My carburetors now look stock and I don't have to crawl underneath to shut off the gas.

http://dauntlessgeezer.com/DG106.html
The inevitable often happens.
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Re: New gasoline shut off valve sticking?

Post by CudaMan » Sat Oct 26, 2019 4:50 pm

I take mine apart every month or so and lube it with EZ Turn, you can get it from the vendors. :)
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Allan
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Re: New gasoline shut off valve sticking?

Post by Allan » Sat Oct 26, 2019 8:43 pm

Are these gizmos fitted because the carburetor leaks?

Allan from down under.


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Re: New gasoline shut off valve sticking?

Post by JEC » Sat Oct 26, 2019 9:08 pm

I lube cone valves with an aviation product called fuel lube.


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Re: New gasoline shut off valve sticking?

Post by Scott_Conger » Sat Oct 26, 2019 10:40 pm

In my case, they are fitted because the carb MIGHT leak (like my '13 which after 5 years of drip-free driving decided to piddle 8+ gallons into the rental space it was living in for a couple of years). I'm sure I was NOT popular there for a couple of weeks, though no one said anything. All my cars now have a shut-off that can be gotten to from under the hood. With a gravity feed system, you just never know... :o
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Re: New gasoline shut off valve sticking?

Post by Joe Reid » Sun Oct 27, 2019 12:12 am

Modern gas has no lubricating properties. On all of the shut offs if you lift it up and turn it it moves easier. They are brass on brass and a tapered shaft. A little WD40 and a pair of pliers help. Remember to lift up and turn.


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Re: New gasoline shut off valve sticking?

Post by Chad_Marcheese » Sun Oct 27, 2019 7:57 am

Take it apart and use the aviation EZ Turn lubricant sold by the vendors. I have found sometimes it takes repeated applications before it seems to settle in a bit.

The new fuel today with its alcohol additives washes alot of the lube out of the fittings. I buy supposed non ethonal fuel for the T and lawn equipment which seems to help, but those brass on brass valves after a while will still stick. I have found after 2-3 applications of EZ Turn, it seems to last much longer now.

I have no issues taking the valve apart to lube them, the issue is, the tank usually needs to be drained on the doodlebug. My T pickup has a 1/4 turn at the carb but the tank shut off is a modern Ford 9N replacement sediment bowl with a round turn valve.

A tube of EZ turn will probably last you a lifetime.

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Re: New gasoline shut off valve sticking?

Post by joe.wal » Sun Oct 27, 2019 7:58 am

Even across the ocean the less expensive one needs a plier to be turned ;) - and mine does leak from the top also.
Having found the trick earlier on this forum I too do lift it from time to time.
As I do always some checks before driving the shut off valve is just one step more - not really a problem.
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Re: New gasoline shut off valve sticking?

Post by otrcman » Mon Oct 28, 2019 12:02 am

I had the "tight valve" problem with my light airplane. A fellow older and more experienced than I suggested adding a bit of (I won't say what type) oil to my fuel. The oil left just a bit of a coating on the intake & exhaust valve stems to prevent the ever-present sticky valve problem, and pretty much fixed the sticky fuel cock problem to boot.

Just to avoid starting yet another MMO debate, I'll say the I eventually settled on motorcycle two-stroke oil. It worked about the same as the other stuff, but took less oil per gallon for the same result.

About an ounce per gallon added to the fuel forever ended both sticky valves and sticky fuel cock. And no, I never saw any residue on my spark plugs.


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Re: New gasoline shut off valve sticking?

Post by hollanbl » Thu Feb 13, 2020 2:47 pm

Anthonie,

I like your fuel shut off ball valve configuration. I do have a couple of questions. Is the banjo bolt that threads into the carburetor a straight thread. All the ones I have ever seen are straight threads with the two crush washers that make the seal. Did you rethread the carburetor to accept straight threads. I thought the carburetor has 1/4 pipe threads that make the seal. I am a new member here and I am having a little problem with gas seeping out of the standard shut off valve. I want to replace it with a ball valve. Your setup looks very nice. Thanks! Brad Hollan

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Re: New gasoline shut off valve sticking?

Post by CudaMan » Thu Feb 13, 2020 5:06 pm

I use EZ turn like Chad says. I have to disassemble the valve and re-apply EZ turn every month or so, no big deal. :)
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Re: New gasoline shut off valve sticking?

Post by Adam » Thu Feb 13, 2020 5:36 pm

A little Marvel Mystery Oil in the gasoline definitely could keep fuel valves from sticking...

I’m not a fan of any of the grease type fuel valve lubricants. As a matter of fact, I actually think it is a poor choice in a non-pressure fuel system. If any bit of it gets loose and goes down stream it can plug a fuel line, slow down flow, cause float valve issues. I have a suspicion that grose-jets are a bit more sensitive to it also.

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Re: New gasoline shut off valve sticking?

Post by DanTreace » Thu Feb 13, 2020 5:47 pm

Similar experiences. Result of today’s gasoline formulations , ethanol, drying additives, etc. After while the shutoff can get tougher to turn.

So, as noted, just pull up on handle, against spring, spray a shot of Kroil oil, and release. Open and close a few times and good for a couple of months ;). Just like oiling other moving parts on your Ford :)
The best way is always the simplest. The attics of the world are cluttered up with complicated failures. Henry Ford
Don’t find fault, find a remedy; anybody can complain. Henry Ford

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Re: New gasoline shut off valve sticking?

Post by TWrenn » Thu Feb 13, 2020 7:18 pm

Bite the bullet and get one of these from Langs. Near as I know, they're about the only source or them.
I put one on all my T's. and was glad. They don't stick, and so far, don't leak. I will admit, one is a bit stiff, but
I never needed a tool for it. It has since gone bye-bye when I sold the car though!

https://www.modeltford.com/item/6055.aspx

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Re: New gasoline shut off valve sticking?

Post by AndreFordT » Thu Feb 13, 2020 8:16 pm

Every other tank fill up I add 1/2 liter of two stroke oil to the tank.
I never had a stuck shut off valve and I lubricate the intake valves at the same time.
Just use the cheapest two stroke oil I can find.

Just my way.

Andre
Belgium

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Re: New gasoline shut off valve sticking?

Post by Bill Robinson » Thu Feb 13, 2020 9:42 pm

This works for me. Pretty easy, too.
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Re: New gasoline shut off valve sticking?

Post by RajoRacer » Thu Feb 13, 2020 11:01 pm

That tool would work much better IF you could slightly pull upward as you turn !


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Re: New gasoline shut off valve sticking?

Post by Scott_Conger » Thu Feb 13, 2020 11:08 pm

Steve

isn't THAT the truth. The only thing I can seem to accomplish with those is to unwittingly and permanently jam the petcocks closed so that oil neither drips nor flows.
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Electric gas valve

Post by Novice » Fri Feb 14, 2020 12:52 am

A electric valve at the gas tank will eliminate the problem and be out of sight on pre 26 models and eliminate the need to raise the hood every time You start the car reducing wear on the hood hinges and catches. The vendors sell both 6 & 12 volt valves. Both of my Ts have the cheap brass valves that get hard to turn when cold. they turn fine after they warm's up. It amazing how much gas can flow out of a model T gravity fuel tank in a short period of time when the float sticks. "Ax Me how I know"


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Re: New gasoline shut off valve sticking?

Post by jerry knouse » Fri Feb 14, 2020 9:52 am

Amazon sells a petcock socket set that fits 1/4 drive. Great little tool

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Re: New gasoline shut off valve sticking?

Post by TRDxB2 » Fri Feb 14, 2020 12:28 pm

A possibility. A min ball valve with viton seals. ($4.11 + shipping) If the handle doesn't satisfy you desired vintage look, I'm sure you could fabricate one from your broken one. This company has several styles / sizes Go to their site and click on the PDF - datasheet on this page to see whats availabe
https://blackhawksupply.com/products/mi ... ball-valve
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Scott_Conger
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Re: New gasoline shut off valve sticking?

Post by Scott_Conger » Fri Feb 14, 2020 5:57 pm

Frank

these are an excellent choice and when properly fitted, allow you to remove the carb for servicing without losing a bunch of gas. While like most, I have carb-mounted valves and frankly while they stop the risk of fire and dripping, it is dumb to have them directly attached to the carb. My next project this spring is to fit a very similar valve as you have pictured, to my driver, though it will be one with a smaller handle. This really is the way to go...
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Re: New gasoline shut off valve sticking?

Post by Steve Jelf » Fri Feb 14, 2020 10:46 pm

IMG_2341 copy.JPG
I still prefer this. The sediment bulb shutoff works for me.
The inevitable often happens.
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Re: New gasoline shut off valve sticking?

Post by TRDxB2 » Sat Feb 15, 2020 1:50 am

Scott_Conger wrote:
Fri Feb 14, 2020 5:57 pm
Frank

these are an excellent choice and when properly fitted, allow you to remove the carb for servicing without losing a bunch of gas. While like most, I have carb-mounted valves and frankly while they stop the risk of fire and dripping, it is dumb to have them directly attached to the carb. My next project this spring is to fit a very similar valve as you have pictured, to my driver, though it will be one with a smaller handle. This really is the way to go...
Scott that valve even comes in several handle variations even just a screw to turn it on/off. I also played with this concept to replace the sediment bulb - thinking that when I cleared some sediment out of the tank I would replace the filter. The filter is a high flow K&N filter (not a lawn mower one), screen mesh is very similar to stock brass screen in size and mesh. It is also a ball valve with viton seals so it will not be effected by Ethanol gas . The fitting for the fuel line may vary based on what the fuel line has
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