Ford trimotor sign

[Allen Banks]

Anyone know the history behind this sign? Found several on eBay, looks like 3 different sizes and colors. What year were they made? It's porcelain and has some wear.

[Shane Lach]

Not sure on value but that looks like a real sloppy fake sign. Buyer beware.

[Dropacent]

I would agree 100% with Shane. Signs are a real problem , as they have even figured out how to add wear and damage to them. Pay for it accordingly and enjoy a small a nice decorator item.
As an aside, they are building a new ford trimotor at the port Clinton airport museum. A nice museum well worth the visit.

[John kuehn]

Usually the older original signs were porcelain. If it’s porcelain and a repo at least it’s a higher grade ‘repo’.

[Mark Gregush]

Look too at the sellers history, if they have sold several, agree with above. Even with the rusty corners, does not look real, not weathered enough. Here is the same sign in red;
https://www.amazon.com/Ford-Motor-Airpl ... B00LMIDCW2
And a different shade of red;
https://px.libertyaviationmuseum.org/pr ... metal-sign

[Burger in Spokane]

There are currently a number of sources making porcelain signs, some so well done
that even experts cannot discern them from originals, so yes, buyer beware !

In the case of this sign, one has to ask "Why ?". Why on earth would a sign like this
be made ? Who would it be designed to appeal to ? What would motivate the sponsor
to spend the money ? In this case, there just isn't a good reason in a period sense for
anyone to have made this sign. Rather, it was designed to appeal to the latter-day
fanatic of anything Ford, hoping for a large enough number of people will not think
it through that such a sign really makes no sense.

A well-seasoned sign guy can easily spot most new-made signs, because the crudeness
of old signs isn't something the new signmakers try to replicate, but fakers are getting
more and more crafty in plying their wares and some fakes are so well done, it can be
really hard to tell a new one from an old one.

[Humblej]

Island Airlines flew Ford Trimotors from Port Clinton Ohio to Put-in-Bay island until the mid 1980's. The signs in question may or may not be real, but the airline and the trimotor connection is real.

[TRDxB2]

There are several indicators that make be believe this is a fake. The Ebay Seller is zisman78 from Mubai India, and has several nice looking high priced signs for sale
https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_nkw=si ... 0&_fosrp=1
Coincidentally there are several similar reproductions (different colors), also made in Mubai India. This is a picture of one of them and you notice the lettering is almost identical. The C in Clinton, the O in Ohio and the planes number N 7864.

s-l500.jpg (33.69 KiB) Viewed 8925 times

There is a similar reproduction sign for $13.50 on Ebay Duty Free from Chicago IL
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Ford-Tri-motor ... Sw2hxcMMI3

[Allen Banks]

Thanks all! I actually flew on this plane in the early 70s from Put-in-Bay. That's why I wanted this sign so bad. I'm pretty sure it's not a period piece and my guess is it was made in the past few decades maybe sooner. I'm wondering if they made these at all for advertisement. Regardless...it has great meaning to me.
I paid 80.00 for the 18x12. The 45.00 one was a 12x6 or something. The red ones are 22x28.i wanted blue as well so I'm a happy camper. It'll look good on my wall...somewhere.

[Dropacent]

Great display, Allen, that’s what it’s all about. The trimotor serviced all the Lake Erie islands for many decades. If you’ve ever seen one flying, you would never forget it.

[Oldav8tor]

The Ford Trimotor flown by Island Airlines that is pictured on the sign was the last one they owned I believe. It was nearly destroyed in a crash on South Bass Island back in the early 1970's. Rebuilt at great expense, the airline tried to make a go with it but eventually had to sell it and begin flying more modern aircraft. Signs like the ones pictured (if original) would likely only date back to the 1960's and 70's. The plane itself went to Florida where it was almost destroyed (again) by Hurricane Andrew. Rebuilt again at great expense by an outfit in Vicksburg, MI, it is now operated my Kermit Weeks in Florida.

Back in the 70's I used to write for a regional aviation magazine. I had the good fortune to visit Island Airlines and do an article on the Ford after it's resurrection - getting the chance to ride as co-pilot and later fly alongside it with my Cessna for a photo shoot. I found it interesting that Henry used some car parts in the Trimotor - I believe the steering wheels were from a Model A and the brake lever was a Model A shift lever. Pull straight back on the brake lever and you'd brake both wheels - angle it right or left and it applied more braking to that wheel. Until enough speed was reached to make the rudder effective the pilot would control direction with brakes and differential power. It was interesting to watch as the pilot had his right hand on the three throttles and his left crossed over to the brake lever which was between the two front seats. Like a Model T compared to modern cars, the Trimotor was not operated like a modern plane. It was also cool that if you checked out the potty in the extreme rear of the plane and looked into the stool you could watch the terrain passing underneath..... look out below! Trimotors were noted for suffering "salt" damage to their tail skins. (Note: I don't believe such toilets are allowed to be used today

N7584 Circa 1976

[Mark Gregush]

"It was also cool that if you checked out the potty in the extreme rear of the plane and looked into the stool you could watch the terrain passing underneath..... look out below!" OMG that is just so damn funny.

[Dropacent]

Ford always gets the credit, but William Stout actually brought forth the stout metal airplanes. The ford trimotor, in other words.

[TFan]

Here is a picture of the one I have had for several years probably at least ten years. When I bought it at a flea market I knew it was a fake but I liked it . It measures 8" x 12" and has the brass gromets on the corners and very nice porcelain. The reason I say "fake" instead reproduction is because I don't believe there was ever one produced for the airlines, so if there was no original no reproduction. I have lived in the area for most of my years and never recall seeing one anywhere. I used to watch that thing fly back and forth to the islands and wonder how something so slow could stay in the air. Jim

[John kuehn]

So after reading the information about the Ford Trimotor sign, was there an authentic sign made? If there was does anybody have one or is there a source of a pic of the actual sign?
Maybe a collector of Ford signs has one?

[Dropacent]

John, just a fantasy piece. Island airlines, in my lifetime , was based out of Sandusky Ohio, and also flew into Keller field in Port Clinton. They serviced the Lake Erie islands ( Kelleys, South Bass Island, Middle Bass, and North Bass. I think they flew regularly to Pelee island in Canada until passports became an issue. Jim Reidy would remember when Sandusky shut down their airport and is now just out of Port Clinton. I think I’ve seen some old wood signs in various local museums, but it was never a big enough deal to foot the bill on porcelain advertising stuff. Of course, I’ve been wrong before, but I don’t think so. I lived on Kelleys island for several years, and the island airlines were ( are ) the lifeline for the several hundred people that make these islands their year round homes. School kids back and forth, groceries,beer, bodies, alive and dead. Until the 90’s , ferry service was really weather dependent, and for many months these airplanes were the only thing making these islands inhabitable. I remember the first time I flew my family of four round trip , it was $80. That was about 1993, I’d hate to guess what it costs now.
As mentioned above the museum in PC is worth the visit. Many auto clubs visit there. This mentions the rebuilding of the trimotor, but I believe the docent told me is was a recreation, all new. Maybe they are using an original rivet!

[Dropacent]

I was the caretaker of one of these about ten years ago. I couldn’t afford to keep it very long, and it went to a fellow ford collector, who has recently passed on. It was an original, never having been riveted to a ship. Beware, there are fakes of these out there, too. The crisp detail on the original was amazing. SO, if you ever get one offered, check the fine detail. I’d buy a cheap fake to hang on my wall, though.

[Steve Jelf]

Some of you will recall that I used to manufacture reproduction old signs. Many were exact reprints of original designs, and many were fantasy signs I made up from period advertising. Almost all of them were an odd non-original size, and all were identified by my name and contact info printed on on the back. That didn't stop a few crooks from passing them off as originals to unsuspecting suckers. I still usually see some of my signs for sale at Hershey. Sometimes they're offered at a reproduction price, and sometimes they're priced like an original. Once when I spotted one of my signs for sale I told the seller, "I made this sign." He replied, "No you didn't!" Buyer beware.

Reproduction of a real 1928 sign.

Fantasy sign from period advertising.

[Tmooreheadf]

I have that sign in the red color. Mine was purchased about 10 years ago from the EAA ( Experimental Aircraft Association)when they visit Louisville, KY. I bought it to remember that particular flight but to also remember the several times riding in the Trimotor flying to South Bass Island in the 60's and 70's. Mine is certainly a reproduction. It is actually cast aluminum with the letters being raised up from the base. The EAA was actually selling them.

[dmdeaton]

I have the red sign. I bought it at the Port Clinton airport hanger where they were restoring the original plane. They were not selling them as originals.

[TFan]

Danny, You got me to thinking I thought I got mine at one of the local flea markets but on second thought I may have got it at the museum over in P.C. several years ago. Out of curiosity what part of Ohio are you from. Jim

[Oldav8tor]

While we're talking airplanes - remember that Trimotors were built at Ford Field which was adjacent to what is now the Henry Ford Museum and Greenfield Village.

The signs under discussion were likely originally produced to be sold as money-makers...what I can't say for sure is whether Island Airlines started the whole thing or not... I suspect they may have as I remember a number of Trimotor related items for sale at their main office. At the time they were trying to recover from the expense of rebuilding N7584 after the crash. Checking my logbook and the article I wrote I saw I was off on the date - it crashed July 1 1977 as the result of a double engine failure due to fuel starvation - had something to do with a poorly positioned fuel selector as I recall. I saw photos of the original crash - the nose was practically torn off. The pilot I flew with had been flying it when it crashed and was seriously injured. He walked with a cane as a result but still loved the old Ford.

I made a donation when I visited and received the attached sticker as a result. Note that the artwork is the same - proof that Island Airlines had a hand in it.

The majority of the rebuilding of N7584 was done by specialists associated with the Kalamazoo Air Zoo. They also provided parts to restore the Trimotor owned by the Experimental Aircraft Association. In particular, they made the dies that allowed them to produce large sheets of corrugated aluminum required for the skin panels. These memories are 40 years old so if I've erred in my recollections don't flame me too bad
Island Airways ceased operations in the Mid-1980's.

[Dropacent]

OT a bit, but need to fix some misinfo I posted above. I have not been to the museum in a half dozen years, and it’s so close, we need to do so again soon. Here I send some info on the Internet, and I wasn’t aware of any of it. From my first visit , it is a very active and unusual museum. Well worth the visit If in the vacationland area of northern Ohio.

[Oldav8tor]

Tim,
Sounds like a great stop on a Model T tour. I read up on it a bit and was impressed... I didn't know it existed which shows how long it's been since I visited the airport there.

[dmdeaton]

Danny, You got me to thinking I thought I got mine at one of the local flea markets but on second thought I may have got it at the museum over in P.C. several years ago. Out of curiosity what part of Ohio are you from. Jim

Jim,
I am in Hamilton, close to Cincinnati

[Ruxstel24]

I was just a youngin, maybe 8-10, but I’m pretty sure the family and the Akron T club toured to Put-In Bay and I’m sure we rode in the Tin Goose. Just not positive of where...
I remember you had to holler directly in someone’s ear to be able to hear, it was so freakin loud !!

[mortier]

The old enameled porcelain signs were produced by applying colored glass powders to a steel sheet and then melting the glass onto the steel in an oven; the same way enamel jewelry is made. The early license plates were also made this way. Is anyone making signs like that today?

[TRDxB2]

Here are some in the USA
https://www.signsporcelain.com/
http://www.cherokeeporcelain.com/
https://vintageconceptssignsllc.com/
Lots of others Google porcelain sign makers

[babychadwick]

I was the caretaker of one of these about ten years ago. I couldn’t afford to keep it very long, and it went to a fellow ford collector, who has recently passed on. It was an original, never having been riveted to a ship. Beware, there are fakes of these out there, too. The crisp detail on the original was amazing. SO, if you ever get one offered, check the fine detail. I’d buy a cheap fake to hang on my wall, though. 990C50C3-63E9-46C8-9D52-8FCC42EF0F69.jpeg

The correct insignia wasn't riveted on but pressed into the siding and constituted the ford script with wings. Harrah was able to gain access to the trimotor our (family) friend had (the one used in Temple of Doom) and copy it when he restored his. My grandfather had a less than perfect stamping he was given.

[Dropacent]

The plain rim around the thin stamped sign was formed to the metal siding and then riveted on. The one I had and sold had never been installed on a ship. I would bet a copy would have been cast instead of stamped. Not that it matters to anyone, but what’s up with this post?

[babychadwick]

Just scanning previous topics and the trimotor is a favorite. I can remember when I was about 7 or 8 seeing it at my friends airport with a flat tire. The original had it stamped into the siding which is why Harrah asked to be able to reproduce it. Having that reproduction (the slightly mis stamped one) on my grandfathers wall is a memory is all

[Erik Barrett]

I flew on one of these a couple times when it came to the Auburn air show. Like no other airplane I have been on. That plane later crashed at another air show when someone forgot to remove a strap used to secure the rudder when it is parked. There is video of that event.

[ModelT46]

Here is a photo of my own TriMotor. It hangs from my living room ceiling. The props turn when it is pulled on a flat surface. I have not heard of another example of this toy, but there probably more out there.

[ModelT46]

There is one of these toys for sale on eBay. $340

[John Codman]

I have flown on the Island Airlines Tri-motor. It is now owned by the EAA and was restored after it was badly damaged by a storm while parked.