MTFCA Forum

Is there any way to know for sure if your early T was built at the Piquette Avenue plant? I've read differing opinions as to when exactly production moved to Highland Park, but is there any documents from the era that disclose which were the last T serial numbers to be put together at Piquette? My 1910 touring, serial number 15851 has a build date of 2/4/10, which would be early in the calendar year so I'm wondering if it was built at Piquette. Any information would be appreciated, thanks!

Come on, isn’t there anyone that can assist with this question?

I can’t confirm it but I believe that my 33435 was a Highland Park build as it was in November 1910
when it was shipped over to Canada and a “ engine only, special RH Control”

Alan in Western Australia

Allan, shouldn't that be an engine ???
Per Steve Jelf's post ???

Alan, thanks for responding to my post! I was beginning to think I did something wrong in posting this query, since on one responded. I think, from everything I've read online, that the Piquette plant opened in January of 1910. Therefore, my February 4 1910 Touring must have been built at the Highland Park plant, unless they were still building them at Piquette at that time as well. I sure wish someone with some Piquette facts could chime in.

I know there are those who know more than I do about early T production. Seems I recall the number of Ts produced at the Piquette plant to be around 10,000.

The Piquette site writes the following:

HISTORY
The Ford Motor Company’s first purpose-built factory. Previously space was rented on Mack Ave.
Ford Models B, C, F, K, N, R, S, and T were assembled here.
The Ford Model T was developed here, introduced in 1908 as a 1909 model.
The first 12,000 Model Ts were assembled here and shipped out by railroad.
Ford Motor Company relocated to its new Highland Park Plant in 1910, selling the Piquette building to Studebaker in 1911.

Link:
https://www.fordpiquetteplant.org/about/history/

According to the MTFCA Encyclopedia, that should be about late October 1909. The encyclopedia does say dates are based on sale, not manufacture.

Link:

http://www.mtfca.com/encyclo/sernos.htm

For what it's worth, I thought some components were still assembled at Piquette for a time after Highland Park began production.

My research on my T which is serial number 11150 is that it was finally assembled at the Piquette plant on Oct 4, 1909. The transmission shaft is stamped 09 30 09.

The reference from the Piquette plant reads:

The first 12,000 Model Ts were assembled here and shipped out by railroad.
Ford Motor Company relocated to its new Highland Park Plant in 1910, selling the Piquette building to Studebaker in 1911.

It never states or implies, any cars were assembled at Highand Park in 1909.

Others on this forum have been providing you with good information.
The first ~12,000 Model T's (1909 and 1910 model years) were made at Piquette.
Production cars (not experimental cars) started leaving Piquette on September 27, 1908.
Production of 1910 Model T's began July 31, 1909 - yes, at Piquette.
Ford pulled out of Piquette, however, in very early January 1910 to go to the Highland Park Plant.
Your serial number (assuming that was the original serial numbered engine in your car) accurately puts your engine assembly date as February 4, 1910.
The information you have provided make it mostly clear that your assembly was at Highland Park.
But wait! This is the time where Ford history buffs usually chime in and accurately declare that your Model T could have been assembled in about 40 other places! FMC setup up multiple places in the US and abroad to assemble Model T's.
The good news for you is that these "branch assembly locations" did not appear until 1911 and after.
I tell people that my 1916 Model T could have been assembled just about anywhere!
-----------------------------
Bottom line - your car was assembled at Highland Park - IF it has the original engine.
----------------------------
The next time you are in Detroit, I welcome you to come to Piquette. We have lots of displays and vehicles that you might enjoy. While we primarily focus on Piquette-built cars, we proudly provide significant historical data on all Ford cars from 1903 through 1927.

I hope this was helpful to you.

By the way - YES, I failed to answer your original question and provide the last serial number on an engine that left Piquette in early January 1910. Great question! I do not know the answer, but let me work on that one. I am not an "expert" - just a guy who soaks in a lot from others.

Thanks,
Steve Shotwell, President (also maintenance man, snow shoveler, painter, stainer, roof fixer, toilet plunger and light bulb guy, etc.)
Ford Piquette Avenue Plant

I am not an expert on the early brass T but thought I read somewhere that the engine number matched the body tag number on 09 and 10 T's. Am I wrong or is this true? Can we tell anything from the body tag numbers on the early cars?

From Bruce McCalley research (CD Encyclopedia)

1911 OCT 6 (Acc. 509, Letter)
Motor and body numbers not to agree in the future.

Based on a sample of one, there appears to be no connection between engine numbers and body numbers on the Piquette Ts. My engine number is 11150 and the body number B7264. Pictures of both numbers on my T are in my 2018 thread on the resurrection of my Model T.

Steve S. Thanks for posting! It's really nice to see to see the pres of a most cherished place for us posting here.
Should I ever get near Detroit again, I'm going to visit your shop! Light bulbs or no!
I need to do that. I'd likely weep and potty my pants tho due to the history.
True.

Wow, great information Steve - thanks! I was hoping you'd chime in, since you have spent a lot of time at the Piquette Plant. Your research is top notch and I do hope that perhaps you can find the last numbers assembled at the plant. And Tony, I believe Bob was referring to the Ford body tag located on the front seat front that typically has the same number stamped on it as the engine does, at least for the early cars I believe. The body number you're referring to is the one stamped into the wooden seat frame done by the maker of the wooden bodies. Since yours begins with a B, as does mine, it indicates that Beaudette (or Pontiac body I think) located in Flint built the body and it has nothing to do with the engine numbers or any other numbers that Ford applied.

Bill, could you post a picture of the location of the “Ford body number” so I know just where to look on mine.

Tony, I don't have any photos but I think I've misspoke; it's called a patent data plate and it's the metal one that Ford attached to the front of the front seat riser.

I have that plate but it Is illegible, I’ll look more closely and report back.

This is a photo of the body plate that was on the top of the kick panel

Tony:
That is what happens when someone takes a buffer to a patent plate. What a shame!

Tony, I believe that patent plate is incorrect for your 1909; the early ones (1909-11) were a smaller, vertical rectangular plate with the number stamped at the bottom of the plate. Yours appears to be a pretty old looking 1913-16 patent plate that someone stamped an early number on. Do you know if your body is original to your engine?

I believe the body and engine were original to the chassis. The holes in the body match the holes in the patent plate. However I suspect the vehicle was first restored in the 1950’s as it has a replacement firewall with the manufacturers name and town stamped under the coil box. The manufacturer moved towns in the early 60’s,so I’m fairly confident about the date of the first restoration.