Two Problems
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Topic author - Posts: 50
- Joined: Mon Apr 01, 2019 7:32 am
- First Name: Patrick
- Last Name: Ortlauf
- * REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1926 Ford Model T Two Door Sedan
- Location: Schrozberg
- Board Member Since: 2019
Two Problems
Hi
My name is Patrick i come from germany,my english is not so good.
I have a Model T from 1926/27
The first problem is that my first gear does not work properly, on the straight it goes but as soon as a mountain comes, it no longer makes it, second gear works fine.
I have already renewed the brake bands but they didn't get any better. I forgot to bathe them in oil first.
Now I've bought new cams and I hope that's because I can't think of anything else
Do you still have ideas? Or do you see what is wrong in the pictures?
The second problem is, I found this sheet metal plate in the oil pan, it's from the magnetic disk
the car has been running so far.
do I really need this?
because that would be a bit more work, right?
greetz
thanks patrick
My name is Patrick i come from germany,my english is not so good.
I have a Model T from 1926/27
The first problem is that my first gear does not work properly, on the straight it goes but as soon as a mountain comes, it no longer makes it, second gear works fine.
I have already renewed the brake bands but they didn't get any better. I forgot to bathe them in oil first.
Now I've bought new cams and I hope that's because I can't think of anything else
Do you still have ideas? Or do you see what is wrong in the pictures?
The second problem is, I found this sheet metal plate in the oil pan, it's from the magnetic disk
the car has been running so far.
do I really need this?
because that would be a bit more work, right?
greetz
thanks patrick
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- Posts: 2385
- Joined: Fri Jan 04, 2019 4:17 pm
- First Name: Mark
- Last Name: Strange
- * REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1924 Cut Off Touring (now a pickup)
- Location: Hillsboro, MO
- MTFCA Number: 30944
- MTFCI Number: 23667
- Board Member Since: 2013
Re: Two Problems
The piece of metal is a magnet clamp off of the flywheel. It looks like it bounced around inside the transmission and damaged some of the magneto coils. If a magnet lets go while the engine is running it will cause catastrophic damage, looks like you caught it just in time.
You need to pull the engine out and rebuild the flywheel and magnet assembly. You also need to rebuild or replace your magneto coil assembly on the back of the engine block.
Your new bands look good, If they were adjusted properly I don't know why your low gear wasn't working well.
If you don't already have it, you need to get the Ford Model T service manual:
https://www.modeltford.com/item/T1.aspx
You need to pull the engine out and rebuild the flywheel and magnet assembly. You also need to rebuild or replace your magneto coil assembly on the back of the engine block.
Your new bands look good, If they were adjusted properly I don't know why your low gear wasn't working well.
If you don't already have it, you need to get the Ford Model T service manual:
https://www.modeltford.com/item/T1.aspx
Mark Strange
Hillsboro, MO
1924 Cut-off Touring (now a pickup)
Hillsboro, MO
1924 Cut-off Touring (now a pickup)
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- Posts: 4111
- Joined: Tue Jan 08, 2019 7:31 pm
- First Name: Dan
- Last Name: Hatch
- Location: Alabama
- MTFCA Number: 49974
Re: Two Problems
Looks like a hand gernade with pin pulled.
You need to fix it before it blows. It could take the rest of transmission with it or worse. Dan
You need to fix it before it blows. It could take the rest of transmission with it or worse. Dan
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- Posts: 892
- Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2019 12:28 pm
- First Name: James
- Last Name: Bartsch
- * REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: '26 Coupe
- Location: Dryden, NY 13053
- MTFCA Number: 30615
- MTFCA Life Member: YES
Re: Two Problems
And it looks like a wide brake band lining on a pre '26 band? Good luck with your repairs, Patrick. jb
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- Posts: 2385
- Joined: Fri Jan 04, 2019 4:17 pm
- First Name: Mark
- Last Name: Strange
- * REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1924 Cut Off Touring (now a pickup)
- Location: Hillsboro, MO
- MTFCA Number: 30944
- MTFCI Number: 23667
- Board Member Since: 2013
Re: Two Problems
Good catch James, I didn't notice the narrow metal band on the brake.
Patrick, the wider rear brake drum uses a wider metal and fabric band, You have the wide fabric, but not the wider metal band. Here is what the wider metal band looks like, note that it is the same width as the wide fabric. There is one on eBay if you can't find one locally:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/1926-27-Ford-M ... SwHlhfUpFk
Patrick, the wider rear brake drum uses a wider metal and fabric band, You have the wide fabric, but not the wider metal band. Here is what the wider metal band looks like, note that it is the same width as the wide fabric. There is one on eBay if you can't find one locally:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/1926-27-Ford-M ... SwHlhfUpFk
Mark Strange
Hillsboro, MO
1924 Cut-off Touring (now a pickup)
Hillsboro, MO
1924 Cut-off Touring (now a pickup)
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- Posts: 314
- Joined: Fri Jan 04, 2019 10:21 am
- First Name: David
- Last Name: Dufault
- * REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1915
- Location: Concord New Hampshire
- MTFCA Number: 303
- MTFCA Life Member: YES
Re: Two Problems
You take GREAT pictures Patrick.
Good luck with the repairs...it is VERY important that you fix the magneto as others have said. Will save you many dollar if you do it now.
Dave
Good luck with the repairs...it is VERY important that you fix the magneto as others have said. Will save you many dollar if you do it now.
Dave
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- Posts: 4070
- Joined: Tue Jan 08, 2019 1:39 pm
- First Name: Norman
- Last Name: Kling
- Location: Alpine California
Re: Two Problems
While you have the engine and magneto apart, you should check all the magnets for cracks and replace any which might be cracked. The usual place for cracking is where the bend is made . While they are apart, re charge the magnets. Note every other magnet polarity is reversed. That is +--++--+. So if you need to replace any magnets, be sure to get the right ones for the location. It does not matter in what order the magnets are installed on the flywheel, except for the polarity. You want the two like poles together at each place where that iron strip is fastened. You should also get new brass bolts for the magnets.
Do you have anyone who lives near you experienced in Model T's? It would surely help if you can find a mentor to help you.
Norm
Do you have anyone who lives near you experienced in Model T's? It would surely help if you can find a mentor to help you.
Norm
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- Posts: 663
- Joined: Fri Jan 04, 2019 11:15 am
- First Name: Tony
- Last Name: Bowker
- * REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1914 touring
- Location: La Mesa, CA
- MTFCA Number: 32
- MTFCA Life Member: YES
- Board Member Since: 2005
Re: Two Problems
I strongly suggest you acquire the booklets put out by the MTFCA regarding both the transmission and the electrical systems. While pnot inclusive of the early cars, they are invaluable for all black radiator Model Ts.
They will help you solve both your problems.
You do need a correct band for that brake band. Suggest you advertise on the Classified and suck up the shipping or find a friend who travels to the USA.
You can fix the magneto but it will be cheaper to switch to a distributor and remove the magneto. Just an idea.
But get the booklets.
They will help you solve both your problems.
You do need a correct band for that brake band. Suggest you advertise on the Classified and suck up the shipping or find a friend who travels to the USA.
You can fix the magneto but it will be cheaper to switch to a distributor and remove the magneto. Just an idea.
But get the booklets.
Tony Bowker
La Mesa, California
1914 Touring, 1915 Speedster, 1924 Coupe.
La Mesa, California
1914 Touring, 1915 Speedster, 1924 Coupe.
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Topic author - Posts: 50
- Joined: Mon Apr 01, 2019 7:32 am
- First Name: Patrick
- Last Name: Ortlauf
- * REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1926 Ford Model T Two Door Sedan
- Location: Schrozberg
- Board Member Since: 2019
Re: Two Problems
thank you for all replies.
Does it really need to be fixed with the flywheel?
There's a lot of work to do to remove the engine, of course if it's necessary I'll do it.
But I already have a distributor / battery conversion
then do i even need the magneto?
And I've been working on us cars for many years.
Have the Model T now for a good 4 years
greetz patrick
Does it really need to be fixed with the flywheel?
There's a lot of work to do to remove the engine, of course if it's necessary I'll do it.
But I already have a distributor / battery conversion
then do i even need the magneto?
And I've been working on us cars for many years.
Have the Model T now for a good 4 years
greetz patrick
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- Posts: 2385
- Joined: Fri Jan 04, 2019 4:17 pm
- First Name: Mark
- Last Name: Strange
- * REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1924 Cut Off Touring (now a pickup)
- Location: Hillsboro, MO
- MTFCA Number: 30944
- MTFCI Number: 23667
- Board Member Since: 2013
Re: Two Problems
You don't need to have a working magneto coil if you run a distributor, no.
However, your biggest problem is that a magnet clamp came off and your flywheel assembly may come apart during running and destroy the rest of your transmission!
You can fix it now or wait a few drives for it to explode, then fix it. Hopefully the explosion won't damage the transmission case or engine pan.
However, your biggest problem is that a magnet clamp came off and your flywheel assembly may come apart during running and destroy the rest of your transmission!
You can fix it now or wait a few drives for it to explode, then fix it. Hopefully the explosion won't damage the transmission case or engine pan.
Mark Strange
Hillsboro, MO
1924 Cut-off Touring (now a pickup)
Hillsboro, MO
1924 Cut-off Touring (now a pickup)
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- Posts: 493
- Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2019 10:20 pm
- First Name: Steven
- Last Name: Sebaugh
- * REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1924 Touring, 1924 TT Truck
- Location: Jackson, Missouri
- MTFCA Number: 49646
Re: Two Problems
You need to pull the engine. I am pulling mine this winter because I found a magnet clamp and some brass screw heads when I changed the oil this year. Google MTFCA transmission exploded
http://www.mtfca.com/discus/messages/70 ... 1505852037
http://www.mtfca.com/discus/messages/59 ... 1470113584
http://www.mtfca.com/discus/messages/70 ... 1505852037
http://www.mtfca.com/discus/messages/59 ... 1470113584
1924 Model T Touring
1924 Model TT Truck
1930 Model A Pheaton
"It is great to be crazy ... It gives you a lot more options in life"
1924 Model TT Truck
1930 Model A Pheaton
"It is great to be crazy ... It gives you a lot more options in life"
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- Posts: 203
- Joined: Mon Jan 07, 2019 2:41 pm
- First Name: Anthonie
- Last Name: Boer
- * REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1912 touring 1923 roadster 1925 pickup
- Location: Klaaswaal NL
- MTFCA Number: 19790
Re: Two Problems
Patrick ; Das werd viel arbeit , Das habe ich shon viele mahle gemacht .
Ich denke so nicht weiter fahren .
Alles bestens.
Toon
Ich denke so nicht weiter fahren .
Alles bestens.
Toon
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- Posts: 1297
- Joined: Mon Jan 07, 2019 2:42 pm
- First Name: Frank
- Last Name: van Ekeren
- * REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1916 touring, 1916 pick-up, 1924 coupe, 1926 touring, 1927 touring
- Location: Rosedale Vic Australia
Re: Two Problems
For your first problem, it looks like the clutch is not tight enough and would be slipping on hill climbing, should have 13/16" between the drive plate and the fork push ring adjusted on the 3 fingers, with that right the spring should be 2" long.
Second problem. As others have said, engine out and remove all the magneto.
Second problem. As others have said, engine out and remove all the magneto.
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- Posts: 4070
- Joined: Tue Jan 08, 2019 1:39 pm
- First Name: Norman
- Last Name: Kling
- Location: Alpine California
Re: Two Problems
I have had experience with the low problem. I think you are on the right track by replacing the notch and the cam. When these two parts wear out, you can get the pedal adjusted right, however, because of the wear, it won't compress the band, and if you tighten it enough to compress the band, you will be too tight at idle, or when in a gear other than low. The result is a cracked drum. possibly even a drum which breaks in pieces and stops your car.
The other part, I have already explained in a previous post. You can as Tony suggests place a distributor or even run the coils on battery, however, you will still need to pull the engine and transmission and either remove all magnets from the flywheel or fix the existing magnet. Especially to replace that metal keeper and brass screw. While it is apart, you can correct the clearance from the magnets to the coils to prevent this from happening again. Because you could still lose a magnet and destroy the transmission cover or even injure yourself it it flies off while driving.
Norm
The other part, I have already explained in a previous post. You can as Tony suggests place a distributor or even run the coils on battery, however, you will still need to pull the engine and transmission and either remove all magnets from the flywheel or fix the existing magnet. Especially to replace that metal keeper and brass screw. While it is apart, you can correct the clearance from the magnets to the coils to prevent this from happening again. Because you could still lose a magnet and destroy the transmission cover or even injure yourself it it flies off while driving.
Norm
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- Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2019 12:09 pm
- First Name: Philip
- Last Name: Thompson
- * REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1924 touring
- Location: Graham NC
Re: Two Problems
I suspect you have more than 2 problems lol. I am sure I do we well
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- Posts: 304
- Joined: Sun Mar 03, 2019 10:13 pm
- First Name: Dennis
- Last Name: Hoshield
- * REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: '24 RPU (Raodster converted to Pickup)
- Location: Petoskey, MI
- MTFCA Number: 24305
- Board Member Since: 2015
- Contact:
Re: Two Problems
Griaß di!
I agree with the others:
Check clutch spring adjustment.
Get wider brake band for the brake material. (This will not effect your hill climbing, however... Just braking ability on the way down!) The band material is correct... But the brake band is too narrow.
That metal piece came from your magneto... And you are lucky you found it so early. Loose pieces in the transmission are 'ticking time bombs', as we say... It is not IF they cause trouble, it is WHEN. As I believe you said you were running a distributor, and not using the magneto, anyway, you can safely remove it. You could rebuild it later I'm your spare time.... It would be good foe viele Weiß'n, I think!
If you do take the engine and transmission out to remove the magneto ring... Many also remove the magnets. Due to their age, they are prone for cracking or breaking... More flying pieces... And then an out of balance flywheel. In the process of removing things, you will have a chance to inspect your clutch plates. I think it is possible you may find some issues there, also. It is certainly good to inspect everything while taking things apart.
I pulled my engine and transmission out this spring, and am not putting it back together. I found many things that needed to be replaced, or cleaned up!
Where in Deuchland are you? Anywhere near Neu Ulm?
Best of luck!
phia't di
Dennis
I agree with the others:
Check clutch spring adjustment.
Get wider brake band for the brake material. (This will not effect your hill climbing, however... Just braking ability on the way down!) The band material is correct... But the brake band is too narrow.
That metal piece came from your magneto... And you are lucky you found it so early. Loose pieces in the transmission are 'ticking time bombs', as we say... It is not IF they cause trouble, it is WHEN. As I believe you said you were running a distributor, and not using the magneto, anyway, you can safely remove it. You could rebuild it later I'm your spare time.... It would be good foe viele Weiß'n, I think!
If you do take the engine and transmission out to remove the magneto ring... Many also remove the magnets. Due to their age, they are prone for cracking or breaking... More flying pieces... And then an out of balance flywheel. In the process of removing things, you will have a chance to inspect your clutch plates. I think it is possible you may find some issues there, also. It is certainly good to inspect everything while taking things apart.
I pulled my engine and transmission out this spring, and am not putting it back together. I found many things that needed to be replaced, or cleaned up!
Where in Deuchland are you? Anywhere near Neu Ulm?
Best of luck!
phia't di
Dennis
'24 RPU
Petoskey, Mi
Petoskey, Mi
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Topic author - Posts: 50
- Joined: Mon Apr 01, 2019 7:32 am
- First Name: Patrick
- Last Name: Ortlauf
- * REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1926 Ford Model T Two Door Sedan
- Location: Schrozberg
- Board Member Since: 2019
Re: Two Problems
Hi
many thanks for the numerous answers.
I already love this forum hehe.
I'll do it like this, pull out the engine and remove the magneto completely.
I will then look at everything and send pictures here again. You have been doing this with the Model T's for many years.
Because if I pull the engine then I'll do everything. The engine runs so far, I don't want to overtake this one first.
Yes, it's not far from Ulm
my zip code is 74575
greetz patrick
many thanks for the numerous answers.
I already love this forum hehe.
I'll do it like this, pull out the engine and remove the magneto completely.
I will then look at everything and send pictures here again. You have been doing this with the Model T's for many years.
Because if I pull the engine then I'll do everything. The engine runs so far, I don't want to overtake this one first.
Yes, it's not far from Ulm
my zip code is 74575
greetz patrick
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- Posts: 304
- Joined: Sun Mar 03, 2019 10:13 pm
- First Name: Dennis
- Last Name: Hoshield
- * REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: '24 RPU (Raodster converted to Pickup)
- Location: Petoskey, MI
- MTFCA Number: 24305
- Board Member Since: 2015
- Contact:
Re: Two Problems
Very good Peter... I think you are on the right track. I asked, as probably 20 + years ago, we traveled to Bayern with our community band... Stayed in Neue Ulm, and visited Ulm, and the great Ulmer Münster. Our host family picked us up in an old timer ... A 1930s Chevrolet, I believe. The youngest son was doing an apprenticeship for old timer restoration. I wish I could remember his name. His brother was Gunther Prinz. It would certainly be a small world if you happen to know of him!
Best of luck. Much learning comes of taking these apart.... And successfully puting them back together again!
Greetz,
Dennis
Best of luck. Much learning comes of taking these apart.... And successfully puting them back together again!
Greetz,
Dennis
'24 RPU
Petoskey, Mi
Petoskey, Mi
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Topic author - Posts: 50
- Joined: Mon Apr 01, 2019 7:32 am
- First Name: Patrick
- Last Name: Ortlauf
- * REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1926 Ford Model T Two Door Sedan
- Location: Schrozberg
- Board Member Since: 2019
Re: Two Problems
Hello
The plan is now to pull the engine, and then I remove the complete magnetic flywheel! I don't need this when converting the distributor.
What someone has told me now because I always start lever on battery and leave it on battery when driving!
he said then my 6 volt battery is quickly empty because I can no longer switch to magneto.
Would you then also say convert to 12 volts?
so I can bypass the magneto ignition
He said only buy a 12 volt alternator, 12 volt bulbs back and front ready.
The rest of the electrical system can handle 12V.greetz patrick
The plan is now to pull the engine, and then I remove the complete magnetic flywheel! I don't need this when converting the distributor.
What someone has told me now because I always start lever on battery and leave it on battery when driving!
he said then my 6 volt battery is quickly empty because I can no longer switch to magneto.
Would you then also say convert to 12 volts?
so I can bypass the magneto ignition
He said only buy a 12 volt alternator, 12 volt bulbs back and front ready.
The rest of the electrical system can handle 12V.greetz patrick
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- Posts: 4070
- Joined: Tue Jan 08, 2019 1:39 pm
- First Name: Norman
- Last Name: Kling
- Location: Alpine California
Re: Two Problems
Note: When you remove the magnets from the flywheel, you will lose their oil slinging ability, so you need to put slingers on the flywheel to replace the magnets. You need the oil slingers to send oil through the engine because the T does not have an oil pump. Refer to other posts to find out how to do this. I think some of the parts suppliers have slingers for sale.
Norm
Norm
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- Posts: 1198
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- First Name: Mario
- Last Name: Brossard
- * REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1911 Touring and 1914 speedster
- Location: Quebec City Canada
- MTFCA Number: 30981
- MTFCI Number: 30981
- Board Member Since: 1999
Re: Two Problems
Hi Dennis,
Here the link for oil slingers you will need. Personally I will prefer having a working magneto in the goal to have a better performance than running on battery. But it is your choice. Good luck and don't gave-up.
https://www.modeltford.com/item/3276SL.aspx
Here the link for oil slingers you will need. Personally I will prefer having a working magneto in the goal to have a better performance than running on battery. But it is your choice. Good luck and don't gave-up.
https://www.modeltford.com/item/3276SL.aspx
Super Mario Bross
1911 Touring
1914 Speedster
1911 Touring
1914 Speedster
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Topic author - Posts: 50
- Joined: Mon Apr 01, 2019 7:32 am
- First Name: Patrick
- Last Name: Ortlauf
- * REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1926 Ford Model T Two Door Sedan
- Location: Schrozberg
- Board Member Since: 2019
Re: Two Problems
Ok I will buy the oil slingers
I no longer installed magneto ignition / box.
already have distributor ignition.
would have to build everything back again
I no longer installed magneto ignition / box.
already have distributor ignition.
would have to build everything back again