Modern Pistons/modern engine internals in Model T

Discuss all things Model T related.
Forum rules
If you need help logging in, or have question about how something works, use the Support forum located here Support Forum
Complete set of Forum Rules Forum Rules

Topic author
Dpenry
Posts: 22
Joined: Sat Sep 26, 2020 1:36 pm
First Name: Dustin
Last Name: Penry
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1917 Model T racer
Location: Westerville, Ohio

Modern Pistons/modern engine internals in Model T

Post by Dpenry » Fri Oct 02, 2020 10:50 am

Forgive me for this but of curiosity, but I was told by an old timer that you can put modern pistons in the T block, I can't for the life of me find info about this. Is there such a modification? Are there other modifications for the T that can allow it to use modern components?


Norman Kling
Posts: 4072
Joined: Tue Jan 08, 2019 1:39 pm
First Name: Norman
Last Name: Kling
Location: Alpine California

Re: Modern Pistons/modern engine internals in Model T

Post by Norman Kling » Fri Oct 02, 2020 11:15 am

The parts suppliers have aluminum pistons made to fit the T engine. Main difference is the 3 rings are above the wrist pin. They work fine, but need a little more clearance than the cast iron pistons because aluminum expands more than the block. They work fine. I use them in all my Model T.s.
Norm


John kuehn
Posts: 3907
Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2019 8:00 pm
First Name: John
Last Name: Kuehn
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 19 Roadster, 21 Touring, 24 Coupe
Location: Texas
MTFCA Number: 28924

Re: Modern Pistons/modern engine internals in Model T

Post by John kuehn » Fri Oct 02, 2020 11:24 am

Modern pistons would be aluminum pistons which are lighter and 3 rings above the wrist pins. At least for a T. Most believe they are an improvement and I think they are. I don’t keep up with improvements in auto engines but I doubt any of what we would consider modern autos use cast iron pistons. Buts that’s a guess.
A T engine is like most older gas engines. Overtime improvements are made as time goes on.

A great improvement is better engine oil. Most T restorers would be shocked at the differences in the oil that was used in Henry’s time and what’s available now.


Topic author
Dpenry
Posts: 22
Joined: Sat Sep 26, 2020 1:36 pm
First Name: Dustin
Last Name: Penry
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1917 Model T racer
Location: Westerville, Ohio

Re: Modern Pistons/modern engine internals in Model T

Post by Dpenry » Fri Oct 02, 2020 11:29 am

I had heard 283 aluminum pistons were able to be installed in a T block with little machining. I am just curious if anyone had done this and what other internals engine parts could work... it just seems like an interesting idea.


big2bird
Posts: 205
Joined: Mon Sep 14, 2020 10:57 pm
First Name: Jeffrey
Last Name: Hausey
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: Early 23 Touring
Location: Anaheim, Ca.
MTFCA Number: 51193
Board Member Since: 2020

Re: Modern Pistons/modern engine internals in Model T

Post by big2bird » Fri Oct 02, 2020 12:06 pm

Dpenry wrote:
Fri Oct 02, 2020 10:50 am
Are there other modifications for the T that can allow it to use modern components?
There used to be a guy named Fred Upshaw that used Volvo camshafts.
My car has Chevy 6 valves.
All you need is access and $$$$.

User avatar

GrandpaFord
Posts: 146
Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2019 2:46 pm
First Name: Neil
Last Name: Kaminar
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1915 Touring
Location: Mebane, North Carolina
MTFCI Number: 22425

Re: Modern Pistons/modern engine internals in Model T

Post by GrandpaFord » Fri Oct 02, 2020 2:05 pm

The cast iron pistons are heaver than the aluminum pistons made for the Model T that are available from the suppliers. Every revolution the pistons have to stop and reverse direction two times. The heaver pistons take more force to stop and reverse and add more stress to the crankshaft than the aluminum pistons and may contribute to crankshafts breaking. This is especially true at higher RPM's. The cast iron pistons also add more stress to the rod bearings. In addition, the cast iron pistons use an outdated ring design that does not seal as well as modern piston rings. I would not recommend cast iron pistons.

The aluminum pistons do need more clearance and should be cam ground to compensate for uneven thermal expansion. They also need to be broken in more carefully.


Jerry VanOoteghem
Posts: 2952
Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2019 4:06 pm
First Name: Jerry
Last Name: Van
Location: S.E. Michigan
MTFCA Number: 24868

Re: Modern Pistons/modern engine internals in Model T

Post by Jerry VanOoteghem » Fri Oct 02, 2020 8:46 pm

I don't think the OP meant modern Model T pistons, etc. I believe he meant pistons, and other components, from modern cars.


modernbeat
Posts: 126
Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2019 2:09 pm
First Name: Jason
Last Name: McDaniel
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1913 Roadster / 1926 Pickup / 1926 Express-Camper
Location: Dallas, TX
MTFCA Number: 50306
Board Member Since: 2018

Re: Modern Pistons/modern engine internals in Model T

Post by modernbeat » Fri Oct 02, 2020 10:31 pm

With some work you can use a Ford 292 Y-Block piston. But, it will be very low compression unless you are also doing an OHV conversion.

I sent a Pruss head to Wisco. They make custom pistons for the engine building side of our shop all the time. They scanned the head and designed an ultra high compression (actually 6.5 to 1 instead the the 4.5 to 1 that the Pruss head delivers), lightweight piston that uses a modern ring package and is compatible with stock Model-T rods.
Jason McDaniel

User avatar

Steve Jelf
Posts: 6463
Joined: Fri Jan 04, 2019 9:37 pm
First Name: Steve
Last Name: Jelf
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1923 touring and a few projects
Location: Parkerfield, Kansas
MTFCA Number: 16175
MTFCI Number: 14758
Board Member Since: 2007
Contact:

Re: Modern Pistons/modern engine internals in Model T

Post by Steve Jelf » Fri Oct 02, 2020 11:40 pm

Why? If you want a modern car get a Model A. :D
The inevitable often happens.
1915 Runabout
1923 Touring


paul hoogendoorn
Posts: 20
Joined: Thu Jan 17, 2019 10:26 am
First Name: Paul
Last Name: Hoogendoorn
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1922 Runabout
Location: South Africa

Re: Modern Pistons/modern engine internals in Model T

Post by paul hoogendoorn » Sun Oct 04, 2020 4:23 am

I use 265 cubic inch small block Chevy pistons in my T. They are 3.75 inch bore pistons with off-center wrist pins giving more torque at low RPM. Minor machining required to the piston crown to the same shape as T pistons and bronze bushings to be made to compensate for smaller wrist pin size. The 265 cid engine was introduced in 1955 for the Corvette. Pistons with off-center wrist pins are also known as thrust pistons. These pistons weigh less than half the cast iron T pistons and give a very smooth running motor.

Post Reply Previous topicNext topic