MTFCA Forum

JohnH

I ran it long enough for the head to glow purple, simply because it had boiled dry on a long trip. The radiator was original and getting worse. Got away with it with no damage.

JohnH

Having seen what happens when magnets break, I use slingers. There's also less weight on the 3rd bearing. One thing I did notice was the lighter flywheel made doing hill starts different but it didn't take long to get used to it. However, the slinger design is important since some types will break o...

JohnH

Having installed a Red Top Optima, I won't be going back to flooded lead acid batteries. Expensive, yes, but it's worth it. One thing I noticed was a higher cranking speed than from my previous three flooded batteries. It would appear the Optima has a lower internal resistance.

JohnH

Model T's sold in Australia were assembled locally from Canadian parts. Since Canada was part of the British Empire, the cars were considered to be British, and attracted a more favourable tariff, than if a car was imported from the U.S. Also, Canada was producing Fords for RHD which was required in...

JohnH

Mark Osterman wrote: ↑
Thu Oct 08, 2020 8:00 pm
Does anyone actually remove and reinstall bands through the inspection cover? If not .. is there any advantage to bands with removable ears?

Yes, it’s a lot easier than removing the hogshead. Others will disagree, but I think it comes down to one’s dexterity.

JohnH

The shoe should float in the four tabs. Once the drum starts rotating, it will cause the shoe to find its own centre. If the drum is hot, I would be checking the adjustment of the brake rod. With the rod disconnected at the clevis pin, it should be possible to turn the wheel freely with no drag. The...

JohnH

The charge current would appear to be excessive. Try changing the position of the 3rd brush to reduce it down to about 5A. If that doesn't work, the next thing I'd do is check the position of the brush plate. That entails removing the generator from the engine and connecting it to a battery so it ru...

JohnH

My first timer was an Anderson. I cleaned it once in ten years. Now that I use an E-Timer, it's totally maintenance free.

JohnH

I've had the experience of driving an "air cooled" Model T, and luckily got away with it. The water had simply boiled away during a long trip on a hot day - still had the original radiator. It was out in the middle of nowhere with nothing but grassy plains as far as the eye could see, and could smel...

JohnH

It's a right hand drive hogshead, hence the greater wear, since the cam is on the outside. This pic of mine shows the cam arrangement.

JohnH

In my part of the world, I think it will be banning of petrol powered cars first before anything to do with speed limits. Anyway, in suburbia where the speed limit is 50 or 60km/h, the Model T has no problems keeping up with the rest of the traffic. In fact, the only proposals to change speed limits...

JohnH

Canadian production of Model T : 757,030 Great ref. data from Hap Tucker in this 2003 post "Actual Numbers Built". http://www.mtfca.com/discus/messages/331880/355935.html?1366771270 Thanks, Dan. So it does seem Model T production is actually closer to 16 million, which is what I have always thought.

JohnH

My understanding is the often quoted '15 million' is the U.S. production only. What was the Canadian production?

JohnH

I didn't find the repro lining particularly good in terms of stopping power. The ones I used were available about four years ago, and fitted with no problems, although the ends had to be glued down. The original asbestos linings were great in comparison, but of course no longer available. I now use ...

JohnH

A diode would work in that manner....except that the magneto output would now be half wave rectified DC. I'd expect rough running with each negative half cycle of the AC waveform missing. Perhaps a low current fuse might be a better option.

JohnH

Having driven halfway across the city on only two cylinders (a valve retaining pin broke), it's remarkable just what a T engine is capable of. Provided there's a degree of compression in at least two cylinders, and the crankshaft is intact, it will 'run'. I ran my original condition engine for seven...

JohnH

but this is a 1926 with a much larger cam and 1/2" steel cam pins with a shear strength of somewhere between 13,500 and 17,000 lbs in a car that weighs around 1500 lbs. As well if you look at the rear brakes for a mid 50's Ford the only anchor is the wheel cylinder held to the backing plate with tw...

JohnH

12V more reliable? LOL. Just about every American car, and plenty of European ones too, from at least 1919-1954, used a 6V electrical system. How many millions of cars was that? Lots of them great big V8's too. If 6V was so unreliable it wouldn't have been so common for 35 years. No, the problem is ...

JohnH

BE_ZERO_BE wrote: ↑
Sat Jun 27, 2020 7:36 pm
Looks as though the "Bendix Gear" is engaged in the flywheel all f the time.
That raises a concern about longevity.

The Bendix gear is actuated by a solenoid, as per a modern starter. The pic shows it at rest with the Bendix retracted.

JohnH

Given the penny pinching design of the Model T, that suggests there's a need for the pans. Ford did not include unnecessary parts. I don't find them particularly awkward to remove and replace, and I'd have to wonder why anyone would constantly need to do so. Besides, if something falls off in the en...

JohnH

I had the same thing happen. Thought the starter shaft was bent, so took of the cover for a look. All OK and shaft running straight. It turned out that the Bendix cover just needed to be centered more accurately. There's not much clearance between the cover and the bolt securing the Bendix spring.

JohnH

40,000km driving on my set of points always run on battery, and there's plenty left in them. I thus don't consider wear an issue running on DC. Having said that, I've rebuilt coils for others with badly pitted points, but that's because they were using 12V or had set the coils for too high current.

JohnH

The 6V Red Top Optima I bought was worth the extra cost. Not just for being maintenance free and having a low rate of self discharge, but the cranking current is noticeably higher. That is to say, it has a lower internal resistance than the usual flooded lead acid battery. Plenty of online suppliers...

JohnH

I have always used the rear drum brakes on my 26 as a service brake. I've done so for the last 17 years and about 40,000km of driving. They are big drums with lined shoes, so why not use them? Furthermore, I live in a hilly area and drive my car fast so I know if brakes are good or not. I don't use ...

JohnH

Ron Patterson wrote: ↑
Sat Mar 14, 2020 6:14 pm
Another funny thing is I found was rocks, gravel, body putty, newspaper, silicone spray foam and, believe it or not, cement used as re-potting material.
Ron Patterson

Just done a set of coils and found cotton waste as the 'potting' material.

JohnH

I timer or E timer. Is there a difference? The E-Timer works on battery only and has automatic timing adjustment (which can be enabled or disabled). It's operation is such that it takes place of the coil points; that is to say it acts as a master vibrator. This means the coil points are no longer o...

JohnH

I used Permatex to secure the gasket permanently to the pan. The cover side of the gasket is simply smeared with grease to make the seal. Never any leakage problems after 10 years like that. I use the same set up with the transmission inspection cover.

JohnH

Duey_C wrote: ↑
Thu Mar 12, 2020 1:31 am
Looking for 0.22 MFD 400 volt.

You can use two of the 0.47uF capacitors in series to get that capacitance, provided there's room to fit them of course.

JohnH

Dare I ask this? Do you fellows have FULL particulars on these capacitors, including micro farad ratings? The capacitors are 0.47uF 400V, and most importantly have a high dv/dt rating. This is where most folk get unstuck when using ordinary types which fail quickly. http://www.funprojects.com/produ...

JohnH

Extremely happy with my E-Timer. What I like is that it's just a drop in replacement for the mechanical timer with no alterations required (I set my coils up so the points don't need bridging). Even the timing rod didn't need adjusting! And, not forgetting it's built into an authentic timer casing. ...

JohnH

I've used felt in two engines without any problems.

JohnH

Some bike speedos are upset by the Model T ignition system. I've found the Cat Eye brand to be good in several cars so far. Accuracy with mine is spot on when checked with a GPS. I used JB Weld to secure a magnet to the hub.

JohnH

Luke, Unfortunately I don't know what the material was on the bands. And, come to think of it, it was actually riveted, just like old fashioned brake linings. I'd say that the bands were relined with this material during the 1960's just from other things about the car. The material was not woven wit...

JohnH

My experience with the repro brake linings was they were inferior to the original asbestos ones (I use mine for normal braking). I went to a brake and clutch place and had bonded linings fitted. Much better. First, I tried bonded linings with a woven material which worked well, but produced a lot of...

JohnH

My 1923 Fordor has nice bright 6V lights. I get asked all the time how I have such good lights on 6V. Most can't believe that it really is a 6V system. Here is what I did: (1)Rebuilt generator and installed Fun Projects 6V voltage regulator -this is a real voltage regulator, not a cutout. (2)Cleane...

JohnH

Chris, That's an interesting question. The magneto puts out something between a sine and triangular wave and the peak voltage would actually be more than 30Vrms. It's important to note that while the magneto puts out a seemingly higher voltage, the coil actually fires well before the voltage has rea...

JohnH

Luke, The test voltages I use are 6 and 12V. I suppose that for more 'real world' testing the 6V should be closer to 7V, since the battery will be under charge when the engine is actually running. The regulation of the power supply in my tester is not perfect anyway, being just a simple zener diode ...

JohnH

Luke, The LOPT tester unfortunately didn't work as hoped. Ironically, it showed the coil as better with the shorted turns introduced! The principle on which it operates is simply that the coil under test is used to load a self oscillating tuned circuit (operating at the normal line frequency of 15,6...

JohnH

Here are the full resolution scans. I only have basic image editing so can't do a lot with them.

JohnH

Some illustrations from a Canadian Ford Instruction Book:

JohnH

Martynn, this Australian parts catalog might be of interest. http://members.iinet.net.au/~cool386/catalog/AussieFordT.zip It lists all the uniquely RHD parts, although using several different terms; "R.H.C", "R.C.C" "R.C". The RHD parts also have an "R" suffix. Unfortunately, all the illustrations a...

JohnH

Luke, just to give you an idea of what to expect with inductance and Q measurements, my "test"coil secondary measures 8.4 Henries with a Q of 7.66. When the primary is shorted to simulate shorted turns, the inductance drops to 1.1H and Q is now 1.6. I have to say it's a long time since I've bothered...

JohnH

On the subject of shorted turns, I can't recall encountering any coils that I've restored with the problem. I use the Q function of an inductance meter to test for it. So far, the only winding fault has been the occasional open circuit secondary.

JohnH

The heat deflector is a standard factory fitting. (The brake light switch is of course a modern addition)

JohnH

For the fuel tank mounting, there are two pads of material like band lining.

You can see the end of it just above the mounting strap.
It's secured to the firewall with two rivets.

JohnH

The pedals are in the same order as LHD cars; i.e. Low, Reverse, Brake.

As far as carburettors are concerned, the same models are used as per LHD, certainly in later years anyway.

JohnH

Here's my throttle linkage. DSC06595.JPG As can be seen, it's the same as what John E. Guitar has on his tourer. Both our cars are original early 26 Geelong models; only a few thousand between the body numbers. Back on the subject of fuel tanks, there is a dished area just above the low pedal. DSC06...

JohnH

When I got my car, I found it had no magneto, and running on 6v required ALL the available advance! Reading of others' experiences, it seems that 12v is almost as good as magneto. Chris, there was a dyno test done some years ago where 12v operation was found to be at least as good as magneto, if no...

JohnH

Concerning a rising voltage to test coils, it had crossed my mind when I developed my CRO based tester. The reason I only provided a step voltage is because there is no magneto in my car. The object of the design was to simply ensure each coil took an equal amount of time to fire when presented with...

JohnH

Luke, As the designer of the CRO based tester you've referred to, I'm glad it has provided useful information. I've been following your design work with interest, although the programming side is totally lost on me, being of the analog world. Nevertheless, it's fascinating to see your tester develop...

JohnH

First thing I learned about the repro welch plugs is not to use the steel ones. They rusted through in a couple of years. Having being caught out, I then used an Australian 2 cent coin, suitably dished. Then JB weld after punching it in. No more problems.

JohnH

So, it's just a diode cutout, not a regulator.

JohnH

The VR is essentially an ordinary diode cutout with a form of switchmode shunt regulation. To determine whether it's for positive or negative earth, simply test for the diode direction between the generator and battery terminals on the VR. For example, if you were to connect a battery positive termi...

JohnH

After about 41,000km of driving over the last 17 years with only 6V, I'm still waiting for the points to wear out. And, top speed is around 75km/h on the freeway. It's all how it's set up. However, coils I've restored for those who use them on 12V do have a shorter point life. You can tell the 12V u...

JohnH

Ruxstel24 wrote: ↑
Tue Oct 22, 2019 3:49 pm
Wouldn’t modern brake spring pliers work ?
Available at most any parts store.

Some do, some don't. It depends how they are shaped. I find Vise Grips the easiest.

JohnH

I just use the hand brake to stop the car, no need to connect up the pedal.

JohnH

Early coils did not have a cushion spring which made it very difficult to adjust the coils for consistent firing, particularly when operating on magneto. By using a master vibrator, the contacts in each of the four coils is bypassed, and the single contact in the master vibrator takes over the funct...

JohnH

The Fun Projects adjustable bearing works very well and is easy to install. Would certainly use it again.

JohnH

Electrically speaking, I can't see any difference with your modification. All the field coils are still in series, which then feed the parallel connected brushes.

JohnH

In my instance of this happening, it was because the battery was at the end of its life. With the generator charge rate at 5A, and the lights drawing 10A, the battery voltage would start to fall after about half an hour of driving. An analog volt meter will quickly track down the fault. If the batte...

JohnH

Would an E-timer fire a single spark per ignition cycle? The E-Timer provides a continuous spark just like when a mechanical timer is used with original coils. In terms of knowing the 'safe' rev range of the engine, you'll find it's not something to worry about too much. In top gear, a standard car...

JohnH

When I got my T, I noticed the drums had play in them and could be rattled around by hand. I was told any play was unacceptable. 17 years later, and coming up to 40,000km, the drums still have the same play in them. And of course there's always been a rumble in neutral which changes when the foot br...

JohnH

If there is sufficient timing advance, a decent timer, and coils properly set up (equal dwell time to fire works well) 6V operation is fine. Two of the other T's that I drive, belonging to friends, are also 6V but have working magnetos. I set up their ignition systems also, but just out of habit for...

JohnH

I had to glue the ends down because they would otherwise continue at a tangent and rub against the drums. I used JB Weld successfully. The photo shows what happened first time round when I didn't bother gluing them. DSCF1302.JPG Having said that, the repro linings did not function as well as the ori...

JohnH

Connect your voltmeter across the battery terminals with the engine at idle speed. If, when you increase engine revs the battery voltage increases, then the generator is charging. It's just possible that the ammeter has been incorrectly connected into the wiring harness - I'm thinking if the wire fr...

JohnH

Measuring the voltage at each of the following points while the starter motor is cranking will narrow it down: Positive battery terminal, battery side of starter switch, motor side of starter switch, starter motor terminal. A less accurate test, if no meter is available, is to feel the all these con...

JohnH

The presence of two connections makes me wonder if one is for the field coil and this generator is off something after 1939, intended to be used with a voltage regulator. It would be interesting to know the internal connections and brush arrangement.

JohnH

The E-Timer's resistors bypass the coil points. I assume that point adjustment is no longer needed except as a backup if a stock timer is temporarily installed. Don't the coil capacitors need to be operating properly to run efficiently on battery rather than magneto with an E-Timer? I have decent c...

JohnH

One advantage of the E-Timer or I-Timer is that the coils and ignition wiring remain original. If, in the unlikely event of failure, it is a simple matter to switch back to a mechanical timer and keep going. Another advantage of course is no mechanical wear and the timing remains perfect forever. As...

JohnH

Thin screwdriver !! First put blankets or quilts on the ground in front to catch the lens when it pops loose. I’ve done this many times. Stick the thin screwdriver under the rim close to the top rivet. Pry the bucket ‘cam’ area down while gently pulling the circular rim forward. It’ll pop loose and...

JohnH

Knowing first hand how much work is involved in re-babbiting a block and rods, it is surprising that a collection of two piece valves would go back in (not even in their original locations if the pin pricks are any indication) - ready to separate and punch a hole in the head, as I know from personal...

JohnH

The thing which got me into Model T's was a book by Floyd Clymer which I found in my local library back when I was a college student. It's going back a bit over 30 years, so I can't remember its title, but two things really struck me reading it, which began my interest in Model T's. Apart from being...

JohnH

New reflectors made a huge difference to light output. Even better was when I tried LED bulbs from here http://www.classicandvintagebulbs.com/page6.html You can see them installed in my car here https://www.modeltfordclubofamerica.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=1012&p=7358#p7358 The high and low bea...

JohnH

Appears to be the FP diode cutout. Given that it is polarity conscious, it is a diode type and not a mechanical type. Also, I recall the instructions from FP was to set the generator for no more than 5A, not because of the diode rating, but to prevent overcharging. Incidentally, the vacant screw hol...

JohnH

Better than 90% refers to the firing consistency. For example, if the coil is fired 100 times in rapid succession and the dwell time remains constant for at least 90 of those firings.

This coil has 98% firing consistency when tested at an equivalent engine speed of 2000rpm.

JohnH

That's an excellent summary of the ECCT. Prior to my knowledge of its existence, I designed and built a tester operating on the same principles, but using an oscilloscope as the display device. It can be seen here http://members.iinet.net.au/~cool386/tester/tester.html Later, a friend loaned me his ...

JohnH

There are many possibilities. High resistance connections, insufficient wire gauge to the starter. Starter switch burnt or has high resistance contacts. Battery defective - the voltage at its terminals while cranking will reveal any problems there. Starter motor bushings and brushes. Besides measuri...

JohnH

Matt, adding to what Mike has said, I am surprised the micro switch has lasted this long. Not just because it isn't designed for this kind of service - switching so rapidly, but also I wonder about arcing at its contacts because of switching an inductive load. The life for a typical micro switch is ...

JohnH

Why exactly does reversing battery leads lead to prolonged point life?? With DC operation, one point will lose material to the other. That is, one point will develop pitting as the material migrates to the other, which starts to accumulate that material. Which point loses material and which gains i...

JohnH

Coil dwell time to fire certainly does increase as the input voltage is lowered; and conversely decreases as input voltage increases. If a coil is set for a dwell time to fire of 3.5ms (the point at which core saturation begins) when fed with 6V, this decreases to about 2ms when the coil is fed with...

JohnH

And a worn engine is more likely to produce a free start, although inn my opinion not unless the carburetor is not set correctly. That was my experience. With my original engine with loose bearings and worn rings, the free starts were very frequent, if the engine had already been warmed up. As time...

JohnH

I have had a free start with the E-Timer.

JohnH

I have heard that one of the parts used to make the regulator is obsolete, hence the lack of production.

JohnH

I soak them in automatic transmission fluid. I have changed one lining without soaking successfully, but next time I changed it the rivets didn't want to go in as they should. Change of material perhaps? I soaked it and no problem.

JohnH

I use an E-Timer. Prior to that was a TW timer, and two Andersons before that. The first Anderson was actually very good, but after ten years it wore out, and the quality seemed to have dropped when I bought another one. Not that having to maintain the various parts of the car is a problem, but the ...

JohnH

I decided the wear was too much when I measured the firing time vs. crankshaft position and found the variation unacceptable. Along with that was noticeable contact bounce (i.e. the contacts making and breaking intermittently). While the Andersons I used were great out of the box and extremely relia...

JohnH

Could be the higher magneto voltage is making the coils work better by brute force from the higher voltage. There's a number of variables which would be responsible for poor 6V performance. 6 volts will work the coils very well if the capacitors in them have been replaced and the coil points adjuste...

JohnH

I use the dwell time to fire method of coil adjustment; intially I built my own tester using this principle and then bought an ECCT. The ECCT is user friendly for non technical Model T owners, and if the computer interface is used, it will tell you everything there is to know about the coils. What I...

JohnH

E-10 is all I've ever used in the 16 years of owning the T. Haven't cleaned out the fuel system since I got the car. Everything is always clean when I take it apart. I also use E-10 in everything else. It sits for about 6 months in the lawn mower over winter, which always starts up straight away com...

JohnH

It looks like a carbon pile resistance to shunt the generator output to ground, in a lesser or greater amount. Assuming this is correct, as the knob is screwed in, the carbon discs are pressed closer together, lowering the resistance, which shunts more of the generator current to ground. The generat...

JohnH

Hal wrote: ↑
Fri Feb 22, 2019 7:22 am
In my opinion, silicone is a bad idea. It will corrode the wires over time.

Needs to be neutral cure silicone.

JohnH

In the past I have used expanding foam with excellent results. I have also seen silicone RTV used to secure the capacitor.
These days, I just remelt the old pitch in a tin can over a blowtorch and use that. Only enough to keep the capacitor secure is required.

JohnH

Some pics I took today and previous times the club has visited:

JohnH

This is a charming thought, having been driving around with no magnets since early 2010. From everyone I talked to about installing oil paddles, and the instructions that came with them, no mention was made about the triple gear pins backing out. Too late now, I'm not removing the engine to deal wit...

JohnH

If the magneto is A/C, do the LEDs have a built in rectifier to use the reverse polarity? LED bulbs generally have at least one diode for protection against reverse polarity. Some have a bridge rectifier which enables them to work with either polarity. In theory they will work on AC, but are not de...

JohnH

I have been testing some of the LED bulbs from Classic and Vintage Bulbs. First thing to note is that old reflectors are a waste of time with them (or incandescent bulbs). New reflectors make a world of difference. DSCF2781.JPG The bulb positioning is important so that the beam points correctly with...

JohnH

As desirable as original technology is, I have to draw the line at two piece valves. My car no longer has the original cylinder head, as a result of a hole punched through it when the #4 exhaust valve separated into its two parts. The engine was actually running quite well as I was driving down the ...

JohnH

I presume we're talking about axle nuts, and not the nuts used to secure the rims to wheel. In that case, I start at 110 ft. lbs. and hope a castellation lines up with the hole before I get to 140 ft. lbs. Original and repro nuts and axles seem fine with that. After the car has been driven for a whi...

JohnH

I don't have an "I-Timer", but I do have an "E-Timer" - which in appearance, and in terms of wiring and installation, is the same. The difference is it works on battery only - which suits me because I don't have a magneto. What I like is that everything looks totally original; the timer built into t...

JohnH

Duey, a purely resistive load is one that has no inductance or capacitance. A good example is an incandescent light bulb or a heating element. It's hard to avoid getting too technical here, but if one measures the current and voltage fed into a resistive load on AC, using an oscilloscope, the curren...

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