New Day Timer very advanced and walking

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Acpracing
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New Day Timer very advanced and walking

Post by Acpracing » Tue Mar 31, 2020 2:00 am

Hi all-

Have been around for a couple of years but had to re-register.

I've searched old forums, I swear.

I have just replaced the Kent-Atwater my (one and only first) T came with with coils. Actually got it running very sweetly.

BUT the apparent rod location (the 2.5" recommendation and I do have the tool) at full retard seems much too retarded to even start. And sweet idle is sufficiently advanced that the blue wire is almost in the fan belt. Easily 3.5". Runs great though.

Weirder is this: even though the brush arm is flush up against, well, whatever is there and the timer sits flat when installed, when running the damn thing wobbles like mad. The tension doesn't seem exceptional although ive shortened the spring on the brush and further tensioned the retaining arm.

Is my brush arm out too far? Is there a vestigial disc or fitting from the distributor I havent extracted? Any experience with either this advance issue or walking timer? Must also be said that the drag seems to be enough that my old sloppy spark rod actually gets pulled to retard by the running engine. Also I did have to clearance the brush arm a bit for the pin, but the pin was too large for the slot in the arm. Problem is, I cant find evidence or images of what should really be behind that arm on the camshaft... would love a blow-up of the whole stack in there appropriate for a New Day timer.

Still, the advance distance....

Thanks hive-mind!
ACP


Chris Barker
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Re: New Day Timer very advanced and walking

Post by Chris Barker » Tue Mar 31, 2020 6:02 am

I think you already know the answer.
It's not right. The brush must have been pushed in as far as its spring or housing will allow, and that's still not enough.
The timer casing perimeter must rest hard against the timing cover, and the brush must then not be hard in.
I would not run it as you describe.
I have seen very thin washers supplied to go on the camshaft to push the rotor out. You might check to see if you have one there. However, they are only about 0.040" thick.
Is it possible that your rotor and the timer casing are not a matched set - they came from different kits? That might also explain the advance.
Do you have another timer set to check?

If the timer is OK, and there's no spacer washer, you have to think about the camshaft. Are the set screws which hold the front and centre bearings in place? Is there any end float? Can you see via the oil filler if the timing gears are in line? If the cam gear is forward of the correct location, that would retard the ignition a little and need more advance.

What do you mean by the Kent Atwater? Did you have their distributor, or did they make a timer?


got10carz
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Re: New Day Timer very advanced and walking

Post by got10carz » Tue Mar 31, 2020 8:04 am

I acquired a car with a New Day timer that wobbled. The brush was bottomed out. There is a pin in the side of the brush that bottoms out. What I think I did was put in a different brush. You could lengthen slot for pin, or shorten brush. Probably won't take much.


Moxie26
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Re: New Day Timer very advanced and walking

Post by Moxie26 » Tue Mar 31, 2020 8:33 am

The timer gauge tool you have is only for the Ford manufactured timer. all other timers have to be set as per manufacturer's instructions.


Original Smith
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Re: New Day Timer very advanced and walking

Post by Original Smith » Tue Mar 31, 2020 10:57 am

This has been on here before. You probably have a fiber timing gear. Cut a notch in the brush so it will clear the retaining nut for the timing gear, so the brush will seat on the cam.

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Steve Jelf
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Re: New Day Timer very advanced and walking

Post by Steve Jelf » Tue Mar 31, 2020 11:38 am

I agree that measuring distance applies only to the Ford timer, and even there you don't need it. Here's how to time your New Day and most other timers:

http://dauntlessgeezer.com/DG97.html
The inevitable often happens.
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Mark Gregush
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Re: New Day Timer very advanced and walking

Post by Mark Gregush » Tue Mar 31, 2020 11:54 am

Could also be that the timer case spring is bent and not putting enough tension on the timer. https://www.modeltford.com/item/3163.aspx
I would guess that the vertical disk is the shield that goes behind the timer, it would have no effect on the brushes placement in or out. https://www.modeltford.com/item/3222.aspx It remains stationary and the time case rides on it.
Re Atwater question;
http://www.mtfca.com/discus/messages/29 ... 1170023863
I know the voices aren't real but damn they have some good ideas! :shock:

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