Sealed Rear Axle Bearings

Discuss all things Model T related.
Forum rules
If you need help logging in, or have question about how something works, use the Support forum located here Support Forum
Complete set of Forum Rules Forum Rules
User avatar

Topic author
MikeSommers
Posts: 24
Joined: Sat Jan 19, 2019 4:34 am
First Name: Mike
Last Name: Sommers
Location: Liberty MO
MTFCA Number: 31711
MTFCI Number: 23889

Sealed Rear Axle Bearings

Post by MikeSommers » Mon Jun 10, 2019 7:20 pm

Are the sealed inner and outer bearings worth the expense? I have never talked to someone who has them, so I am wondering about the users' experience on this forum.
Regards,
Mike

User avatar

Topic author
MikeSommers
Posts: 24
Joined: Sat Jan 19, 2019 4:34 am
First Name: Mike
Last Name: Sommers
Location: Liberty MO
MTFCA Number: 31711
MTFCI Number: 23889

Re: Sealed Rear Axle Bearings

Post by MikeSommers » Mon Jun 10, 2019 7:21 pm

I am referring to the rear axle bearings...

User avatar

Mark Gregush
Posts: 1551
Joined: Sat Jan 05, 2019 1:57 pm
First Name: Mark
Last Name: Gregush
Location: Portland Or
Board Member Since: 1999

Re: Sealed Rear Axle Bearings

Post by Mark Gregush » Mon Jun 10, 2019 7:32 pm

Do you mean safety hubs and; https://www.modeltford.com/item/2508IRB.aspx (Modern inner rear axle bearing kit)
You will note the bearing is only listed for inner install.
I know the voices aren't real but damn they have some good ideas! :roll:

1921 Huckster
1925 Cut down pickup

User avatar

twrenn
Posts: 331
Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2019 10:53 am
First Name: Tim
Last Name: Wrenn
Location: Ohio
MTFCA Number: 30701
MTFCI Number: 24033

Re: Sealed Rear Axle Bearings

Post by twrenn » Mon Jun 10, 2019 7:41 pm

Mike, Langs has them both, the outer are $198 ea., and the inner are $125 each, so it does get pricey.
I think you have to do some machining for the inner bearing. My '13 came with them when I bought it, so far, so good.
Hope this helps.


tdumas
Posts: 72
Joined: Mon Jan 07, 2019 9:45 pm
First Name: Ted
Last Name: Dumas
Location: Dallas, TX
MTFCI Number: 20999

Re: Sealed Rear Axle Bearings

Post by tdumas » Mon Jun 10, 2019 8:08 pm

Get some good used Hyatt bearings and save the money for other work on your car.

To me $600 invested in rear axle bearings
would kill my Scotch soul.

User avatar

Ruxstel24
Posts: 1657
Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2019 11:25 am
First Name: Dave
Last Name: Hanlon
Location: NE Ohio
MTFCA Number: 50191
Board Member Since: 2018

Re: Sealed Rear Axle Bearings

Post by Ruxstel24 » Mon Jun 10, 2019 8:14 pm

My touring with a Ruckstell has had sealed bearings in it for probably 50 years.
No muss, no fuss, no leaking into the brakes.
I imagine they were a little less pricey then.

Sorry, no grease cups... :lol:


Allan
Posts: 941
Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2019 7:21 pm
First Name: Allan
Last Name: Bennett
Location: Gawler, Australia

Re: Sealed Rear Axle Bearings

Post by Allan » Tue Jun 11, 2019 4:31 am

Ted has the right idea, at least for the inner bearings. They are listed for inner axle use only. Reading between the non existent lines, it may be that they are not capable of carrying the load at the wheel end of the axle. To be able to fit a ball bearing in the space occupied by 1/2" hyatt rollers and the sleeve means the balls themselves must be quite small. The smaller the bearing, the less load it can carry. Safety hubs on the outer end of the axle use a much larger bearing.

I could be wrong.
Allan from down under.

User avatar

Topic author
MikeSommers
Posts: 24
Joined: Sat Jan 19, 2019 4:34 am
First Name: Mike
Last Name: Sommers
Location: Liberty MO
MTFCA Number: 31711
MTFCI Number: 23889

Re: Sealed Rear Axle Bearings

Post by MikeSommers » Tue Jun 11, 2019 9:07 am

Allan,
I believe these are not ball bearings, but rather timkin. They seem a bit pricey, but why not use the best technology available, especially if it doesn't affect the look of the car.
Attachments
Bearing.jpg
Bearing.jpg (13.72 KiB) Viewed 1424 times


Dan McEachern
Posts: 222
Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2019 11:08 am
First Name: DAN
Last Name: MCEACHERN
Location: ALAMEDA,CA,USA

Re: Sealed Rear Axle Bearings

Post by Dan McEachern » Tue Jun 11, 2019 3:56 pm

Seems to me if you want to improve things and not just replace one type of bearing for another, safety hubs would be a much better choice. At least if you break an axle, the wheel won't fall off with safety hubs.

User avatar

Topic author
MikeSommers
Posts: 24
Joined: Sat Jan 19, 2019 4:34 am
First Name: Mike
Last Name: Sommers
Location: Liberty MO
MTFCA Number: 31711
MTFCI Number: 23889

Re: Sealed Rear Axle Bearings

Post by MikeSommers » Tue Jun 11, 2019 6:43 pm

Thanks Dan,
I thought about that, and a friend in our Model T club (KCChuggers) reminded me that even in an axle break, if you had disc brakes, the calipers would prevent the wheel from coming off.

I resisted the thought of disc brakes... but then, Frank drove home the wisdom, "safety trumps authenticity".

That was great advice!
Mike


Allan
Posts: 941
Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2019 7:21 pm
First Name: Allan
Last Name: Bennett
Location: Gawler, Australia

Re: Sealed Rear Axle Bearings

Post by Allan » Tue Jun 11, 2019 7:13 pm

Mike, Timken is a brand of bearings. They make all sorts of bearings for a multitude of applications. I do not know what type of bering is used in that set-up. The carrier looks to be a separate piece, of thickness greater than the original sleeves if it has that O ring on the end. This may mean the bearing is a roller bearing, and that would be considerably shorter than the originals and most likely of lesser diameter rollers.

I second Dan's thoughts on safety hubs.

Allan from down under.


Jerry VanOoteghem
Posts: 131
Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2019 4:06 pm
First Name: Jerry
Last Name: VanOoteghem
Location: S.E. Michigan

Re: Sealed Rear Axle Bearings

Post by Jerry VanOoteghem » Tue Jun 11, 2019 7:19 pm

MikeSommers wrote:
Tue Jun 11, 2019 6:43 pm
Thanks Dan,
I thought about that, and a friend in our Model T club (KCChuggers) reminded me that even in an axle break, if you had disc brakes, the calipers would prevent the wheel from coming off.

I resisted the thought of disc brakes... but then, Frank drove home the wisdom, "safety trumps authenticity".

That was great advice!
Mike
The caliper holding the wheel on is not a guaranteed thing. Just depends on where exactly the axle break occurs. If the axle breaks even with the wheel hub, my bet is that the wheel is gonna leave you. "You picked a fine time to leave me loose wheel....."


Scott_Conger
Posts: 1976
Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2019 11:18 am
First Name: Scott
Last Name: Conger
Location: Clark, WY
Board Member Since: 2005

Re: Sealed Rear Axle Bearings

Post by Scott_Conger » Tue Jun 11, 2019 7:58 pm

While I don't have one of these sets in my hand, it is clearly shorter than Hyatts and very likely much much stiffer. This is not a combination that leads me to believe axle breakage will be reduced. If you want a seal, put in a seal. I own 4 Model T's...if safety was my first priority, I would sell them, not butcher them. You're kidding yourself, anyway, if you think disk brakes make you safe on the road. It's a Model T...you're never really safe, and no accessory is going to change that...if that's an issue, you're sinply in the wrong hobby.

I think this is what you get when you over-protect your children at the expense of life experience.
Scott Conger

Full Flow Float Valves - deliver fuel like Henry intended!


Original Smith
Posts: 1104
Joined: Tue Jan 08, 2019 10:43 am
First Name: Larry
Last Name: Smith
Location: Lomita, California
MTFCA Number: 121
MTFCA Life Member: YES
MTFCI Number: 16310

Re: Sealed Rear Axle Bearings

Post by Original Smith » Tue Jun 11, 2019 10:39 pm

Keep it original. Buy those new aluminum caps if you must, but don't change any of the factory specifications.


Jeff Hood
Posts: 74
Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2019 11:25 pm
First Name: Jeff
Last Name: Hood
Location: Long Beach, CA.
MTFCA Number: 25636

Re: Sealed Rear Axle Bearings

Post by Jeff Hood » Wed Jun 12, 2019 12:47 am

As far as a caliper keeping the wheel in place, it also depends where the caliper is mounted. Where I worked, I got a call one afternoon that one of our police spec Crown Victorias was stuck on the bridge with a bad transmission. The car wouldn't move forward or reverse, so I sent a tow truck to retrieve it. The driver picked it up by the front and towed it down the bridge then turned around and towed it back over the bridge and on to our shop. Upon arrival I asked him to back it into one of the shop bays, and he pulled forward to square up with the bay door and began to back up. As soon as he started moving backwards the right rear wheel turned out and detached from the vehicle. The axle had broken right in the bearing and the rear caliper was mounted on the leading edge (forward) and as long as the car was being towed forward the caliper kept the wheel in place, but as soon as he started to back up, the wheel and stub came out of the bearing and off the car.

The calipers on a Model T disc brake setup are on the lower trailing edge and most likely will not keepthe wheel on the car while moving forward.

Post Reply Previous topicNext topic