Starter ratchet attachment

[NealW]

I learned something new yesterday. I am in the process of pulling the engine on an early 1914 T and I was getting ready to pull the pin holding the crank handle ratchet, when I discovered that the pin was permanently installed with both ends peened. I asked Larry Smith about it, and he said that is how Ford used to do it! Anyway, a couple of minutes with a Dremel with a grinding stone and I was able to drive out the pin. You can just barely slip the fan belt between the ratchet and fan pulley, but there's not a lot of extra room.

I will use either use a pin that takes a cotter key or one of the pins with a spring clip attached to one end that allows easy removal of the pin without the need of a cotter pin. Unfortunately Snyders is out of those right now.

My question to the forum members is whether Ford always peened the pin for the ratchet to the crank handle on all the T's that were produced, or did they eventually switch to the removeable pin with a cotter key? It seems like it would have been cheaper for Ford to use a pin and cotter pin than taking the time to peen both ends, but they were the time study experts. It certainly is not as user friendly as being able to remove it for putting a fan belt off/on.

[Steve Jelf]

...one of the pins with a spring clip attached to one end that allows easy removal of the pin without the need of a cotter pin.

That seems like a great idea until the clip breaks. Yes, it does happen.

[TRDxB2]

They used to sell these.

[TXGOAT2]

Be sure there is room in the narrow nose early pan for a modified pin. My '27 car has a modern clip type pin and it has given no trouble, but it might not fit in the earlier pan.

[DanTreace]

Trent Boggess did a bit of discovery on the topic of ratchet rivets!

While on the subject of the starting crank ratchet, now might be a good time to bring up the subject of the pin used to attach the ratchet to the starting crank. When the forged design crank ratchet was adopted in late 1908, the Starting Crank Ratchet Pin, factory part number T-527-B was adopted at the same time. This was a straight steel pin 5/16-inch in diameter and 1-3/8-inch long. The ratchet was attached to the crank by riveting over both ends of this pin, making the ratchet more or less a permanent part of the starting crank.

When the pressed steel crank ratchet was adopted in 1912, a new pin was designed and given the factory part number T-4491. This too is a straight steel pin 5/16-inch in diameter, but it is only 1-3/16-inch long because the stamped steel ratchets were smaller in diameter at the pin hole than the forged ratchets were. These pins were also riveted over on both ends, again permanently attaching the ratchet to the starting crank. The adoption of the malleable iron design ratchet in 1914 made it necessary to change the length of the pin again, this time increasing it to 1-1/4-inches long. Despite being longer, it was considered to be useable on both the pressed steel and malleable iron ratchets.

The Ford Motor Company was always seeking ways to cut costs, and on September 21, 1914 C. Harold Wills changed the material specification for this pin from open hearth steel to scrap valve stem stock. Waste not, want not was the rule at Ford.

Finally on March 28, 1919 Joseph Galamb made the lives of most Model T mechanics much more pleasant by changing the design of the pin from a straight pin to a rivet with a cotter pin hole. According to Galamb "This change was made to eliminate riveting the pin in place, which is causing a lot of leaks at present, and is to take effect at once: pins on hand to be scrapped if they cannot be used in other ways." This design continued until the end of Model T production in 1927.9


And...hope the accessory "Jiffy" crank ratchet pin can be avail again.....I like 'em!

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[Jerry VanOoteghem]

Trent Boggess did a bit of discovery on the topic of ratchet rivets!

While on the subject of the starting crank ratchet, now might be a good time to bring up the subject of the pin used to attach the ratchet to the starting crank. When the forged design crank ratchet was adopted in late 1908, ....

Thank you Dan for being "on topic" with excellent, useful information. I had no idea that a peened pin was ever used.

[Original Smith]

Something that hasn't been mentioned is the ratchet. I don't know when the size was increased, but it did happen. Perhaps when they came out with the new crankcase? The newer style ratchet will work in the early pans however.

[Steve Jelf]

Apparently the bigger ratchet wasn't different enough to get a separate part number. The parts book shows the same thing for all years.

[DanTreace]

Apparently the bigger ratchet wasn't different enough to get a separate part number. The parts book shows the same thing for all years.

Here is the whole shebang on T ratchets from Prof. Trent

Click on link:


https://www.mtfca.com/encyclo/ratchets.htm