FJ - Is this tire repairable ?

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FreighTer Jim
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FJ - Is this tire repairable ?

Post by FreighTer Jim » Mon Jan 21, 2019 9:38 am

I changed over to 14 ply tires on my trailer.

Second puncture In a week.

Being told - again - this cannot be patched because of the location.

Thoughts ?

FJ
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Re: FJ - Is this tire repairable ?

Post by Jim_PTC_GA » Mon Jan 21, 2019 9:49 am

If it were a farm trailer I'd say plug it and go but if your hauling cars I'd spend a bit and replace it, plug it and keep as an emergency spare.
Just give me time to Rust and I'll be good as new. :) Wabi-Sabi

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Re: FJ - Is this tire repairable ?

Post by FreighTer Jim » Mon Jan 21, 2019 10:21 am

Thanks Jim

I had the first flat on 14 ply tires repaired a few months ago.

Outside plug - recommended by a tire shop - didn’t hold.

If I had it broken down & patched right from the inside,
I wouldn’t have lost the tire.

This makes the third 14 ply tire I have had to replace in (3) months.

FJ

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Re: FJ - Is this tire repairable ?

Post by jagiven » Mon Jan 21, 2019 10:31 am

It looks repairable. I had a nail in one of my Travel Trailer tires last spring in a similar location. Tire shop removed the tire and installed an internal patch.

I would be curious why they say it is not repairable? From everything I have ever heard, as long as it is not to close to the side wall, you can fix it.


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Re: FJ - Is this tire repairable ?

Post by hpetrino » Mon Jan 21, 2019 10:47 am

I had one like that a while back. When I took it to my tire guy (a shop I've used for years and know the owner) he told me that he wouldn't even try to repair it. He said that when the damage is at the "corner" (the edge of the tread) it's pretty much impossible to get a plug to hold.


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Re: FJ - Is this tire repairable ?

Post by Scott C. » Mon Jan 21, 2019 11:46 am

I would not even try to plug it from the out side. Unless in an emergency. But, done properly from the inside, with the right size of mushroom type patch, I think it would be fine. It might require that the plug and the boot to be 2 separate pieces depending on the size and angle of the puncture.


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Re: FJ - Is this tire repairable ?

Post by HaroldRJr » Mon Jan 21, 2019 1:17 pm

For what it's worth, I personally believe that when a tire shop says that a puncture "is not repairable", I don't think they really mean that literally. I think what they really mean, but do not say, is,..."we don't want to fix that, because we have too many lawyers, and too many law suits, and too many ridiculous liability issues in this country, and we just don't want to take that chance."

If they were really being truthful , they would say something like,...."yeah, that tire puncture could probably be repaired with a proper inside patch if you wanted to do it yourself, but we don't want to do it"....,or, maybe even more accurately, "our company policy is not to repair such a puncture as that".

Again,....just my opinion, FWIW,.....harold


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Re: FJ - Is this tire repairable ?

Post by Scott_Conger » Mon Jan 21, 2019 1:27 pm

I think Scott and Harold nailed it.
Scott Conger

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Re: FJ - Is this tire repairable ?

Post by Scott_Conger » Mon Jan 21, 2019 1:32 pm

And FWIW, I am amazed that any reputable tire shop would still plug a tire, anyway. Really excellent odds that the person doing the plug doesn't even follow the path of the original damage, and creates a second leak path right next to the original which will show up soon. I think that is the genesis of FJ's shops refusal to plug. There is a way to do this right with a radial patch, and there is a way that other folks take. Any shop that plugs tires would be off my "visit" list.
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Re: FJ - Is this tire repairable ?

Post by FreighTer Jim » Mon Jan 21, 2019 1:46 pm

The tire shown was repaired by breaking it down & patching it from the inside.

I don’t believe in a plugging a tire from the outside - I did that at the recommendation
of a North Carolina small town tire shop.

First & last time I will ever plug a tire.

FJ

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Re: FJ - Is this tire repairable ?

Post by NHUSA » Mon Jan 21, 2019 3:29 pm

FJ

easy fix --- Just fill it with foamy stuff and your good to go for a few miles. :lol:
NH - Where I live - not the carburetor ! :lol:

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Re: FJ - Is this tire repairable ?

Post by George N Lake Ozark » Mon Jan 21, 2019 3:29 pm

When I worked in a service station as a kid , we were trained to plug or patch. If it was a radial we'd use a tube patch on the inside. Run an awl threw the hole so we could find the leak, then vulcanize the patch on. If the hole was more centered on the tread we'd use a plug.
If it's on the sidewall replace. In the early days of radials if it was in the sidewall we would install an inner tube as a cheap fix.
You wouldn't believe the great number of cheapskates in Beverly Hills .

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Re: FJ - Is this tire repairable ?

Post by John.Zibell » Mon Jan 21, 2019 4:26 pm

I only use a patch plug on tubeless tires. The location of the hole is near the edge, but I think far enough away to try. The tire has to be removed from the rim as it is applied from the inside. I've installed several on motorcycle tires. see: https://www.amazon.com/Hanperal-24Pcs-R ... patch+plug
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Re: FJ - Is this tire repairable ?

Post by Kenny Edmondson » Mon Jan 21, 2019 5:45 pm

Anything more than 1” from the tread edge can be plugged AND must be patched from the inside as well. There is too much rubber movement at the tread edge for repairs to hold. I’m in the trucking industry and punctures more than a 1/4” in diameter and in the outer 1” area must be section repaired. Section repairs wouldn’t be cost effective for the smaller tires and are a little heavy so you’d need a lot of weight to balance.


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Re: FJ - Is this tire repairable ?

Post by wayne sheldon » Mon Jan 21, 2019 5:59 pm

It would depend on the angle the nail went in. The closer to the edge/corner of the tire (inside), the worse chance a repair is. And given the heavy loads, even with the heavy duty plies, probably best to not chance it anyway.
I had quite an interesting talk with a Les Schwab tire shop a few years ago. On our Audi Quatro we used to have, I had a nail right in the corner. Because of the wheel type, I cannot dismount the tires myself, so could not do the repair myself. Les Schab advertises how they help customers in need, so I went there. He would not have told me things he did, except that I had taken business law in college (oh so many years ago!), and phrased my curiosity questions in a way that he basically could not avoid an honest answer. What I figured (from my business law stuff), he said I was correct. They cannot and will not charge for many certain repairs, because to charge ANYTHING makes it a business transaction, and places them in a serious position of liability. Being nice, and doing such repairs for free, does not totally exempt them from liability. However, it greatly reduces the chance of being held liable if such a repair fails. Being nice, and helping people is and should be a good thing. If they wish to spin their advertising around it? I am fine with that. The Quatro is supposed to have ALL four tires replaced at one time for exact match (a drive-train thing). My tires were otherwise perfect with several thousand miles of use. I was in financial difficulties, and did not have the dollars to replace four tires. So I was grateful they were willing to repair it.
I offered to give them a gratuity. But the fellow said they were under strict orders under such circumstances to NOT accept tips or ANYTHING in trade or compensation as that would again leave them open to liability.
Yes, it IS a lawyers thing.

Yes, I do recommend Les Schwab. And guess where I went last year when I had to buy four new tires for my Ford Expedition.


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Re: FJ - Is this tire repairable ?

Post by DickC » Mon Jan 21, 2019 7:25 pm

What ever happened to the practice of putting a tube in that tire? Don't they still make tubes?


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Re: FJ - Is this tire repairable ?

Post by wayne sheldon » Mon Jan 21, 2019 8:00 pm

Dick C, radial tires have two issues with tubes. One, the tires are not made for inner tubes. So they are generally a bit rough inside. Two, radial tires squirm a lot more than bias ply tires do. The two things tend to grind away at the inner tube causing sometimes sudden tube failures.. If inner tubes are used, they MUST be special radial tire inner tubes. Radial tire inner tubes are thicker, and a softer rubber less likely to chafe. Even then, their reliability is highly questionable. Many people recommend that tubes (ANY inner tube) should NOT be used inside radial tires.
I have used tubes inside radials years ago. I sanded the inside of the radial tire and got many years of good service from it (light duty). I personally would not recommend using inner tubes inside radial tires except as a short term patch. Even the radial tire ones. Especially not on heavy loads. And even for short term use, check the smoothness of the inside of the tire.

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Re: FJ - Is this tire repairable ?

Post by John Warren » Mon Jan 21, 2019 9:06 pm

I think you could fix it. You could barter , I take the tire shop a case for gator aid. No money exchanged. :?:
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Re: FJ - Is this tire repairable ?

Post by Dennis Prince » Tue Jan 22, 2019 10:59 am

No one has pointed out the obvious, if that nail leak you need a bigger nail.


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Re: FJ - Is this tire repairable ?

Post by tdump » Tue Jan 22, 2019 11:41 pm

I find it odd that a 14 ply tire does not resist a puncture no better than that.That would be part of the reason I would pick those.

But speaking of trailer tires,if these were mine,they would not hold up the truck,but look at what these little 12 inchers take!
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As it turns out - no

Post by FreighTer Jim » Fri Jan 25, 2019 10:28 am

The attempted repair lasted a few days.

Lucky for me I kept the (4) LT 16 inch 14 ply tires when I installed (4) ST 16 inch 14 ply tires a few weeks ago .....

Now I am down to (2) .....

The only advantage to running 14 ply trailer tires is that when they lose air,
the overall tire strength let’s you “ run flat “ on a tandem axle trailer that
isn’t overloaded without shredding ....

FJ

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Re: FJ - Is this tire repairable ?

Post by Scott_Conger » Fri Jan 25, 2019 10:36 am

It looks as if the hole is not even lined up with the original puncture damage. This goes back to my earlier statement that carelessly done plugs may not even follow the original leak path from inside to outside. That is a real shame. I'll bet a standard inside patch would have held up fine. Bummer.
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Re: FJ - Is this tire repairable ?

Post by Scott_Conger » Fri Jan 25, 2019 10:38 am

guess I jumped the gun...if i reread all the posts correctly, this was patched on the inside. Not sure what the hole on the outside is showing, but I was obviously wrong.
Scott Conger

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Re: FJ - Is this tire repairable ?

Post by FreighTer Jim » Fri Jan 25, 2019 11:50 am

Scott

That is where they tried to patch from the inside.

14 ply LT tires have such a thick tread - unless you get a puncture right in the middle of the recessed area - it won’t hold a patch.

Plus - I have been traveling in single digit weather.

FJ

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Re: FJ - Is this tire repairable ?

Post by Charlie B in N.J. » Fri Jan 25, 2019 11:57 am

Been there. In fact a tire was repaired with an inside patch and it didn't hold. It may not have been done right because we used to use them in the thread area of the tire (Not the sidewall) and they always seemed to work out well. Switched to inside patched way back when the steel belted tires began eating through plugs.
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Re: FJ - Is this tire repairable ?

Post by Jim W » Fri Jan 25, 2019 11:03 pm

Been in the tire industry since the late '40s and if a patched tire fails the fault settles around your shoulders!

If the failure damages a '37 Bugatti, it might be hard on the wallet!

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Re: FJ - Is this tire repairable ?

Post by 26troadster » Sat Jan 26, 2019 10:14 am

If I was on the road all the time I wouldn't but I have in the past.

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Mystery Solved

Post by FreighTer Jim » Fri Feb 01, 2019 3:44 pm

About (6) weeks ago ....

I started having regular flats every few days - same location on the trailer.

Passenger rear - which makes sense because you pick up debris on the shoulder of the road.

This has cost me (4) trailer tires including the one I had to replace today.

A new tire put on just a few days ago went flat - when pulled there was no
sign of puncture or impact.

So I had Discount Tire put it in a water tank & check the rim welds for cracks.

Sure enough - air bubbles from a couple welds.

A bad rim has been the cause all along of tire deflation - the deflated tire
became a magnet for roadside debris and got punctured.

Patches wouldn’t hold because the tire would lose air once repaired.

An expensive lesson ..... :|

FJ

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