21 touring rear top strap question

[Emeraude]

I am starting to install my classtique top on my 21 touring. The instructions use 2 short straps from the rear bow to the tack rail on the rear of the body which will prevent the top to move forward. I have noticed in photos of touring tops that they show straps going from the bow to the body. It appears to me they both do the same thing and if the 2 straps are in place the are the adjustable straps needed. It appears that they do same thing and if so the adjustable strap would not be needed. Would I be correct?

[Norman Kling]

There should be tow leather adjustable straps from the rear bow to the bracket which holds the saddle when the top is down. Be sure you have the correct top. The later one man tops are different. Your car should have the two man top with 4 bows. One in front, one in the rear, and the two in the middle should go straight up. See diagram attached.
Norm

[jsaylor]

I recently installed a new top on my 21 Touring. Had the same question. My existing top had the adjustable straps. I purchased some black webbing locally and used the existing hardware to make new adjustable straps.

[Norman Kling]

On Lang's Catalog page 185 part number 7831STN has the leather straps in case you are interested. They are purchased separately from the top itself.
Norm

[Rich Eagle]

There are some great photos here. I hope it helps.
http://www.mtfca.com/discus/messages/179374/229470.html
Rich

[Emeraude]

Thanks for the reply’s. My question still is , is the adjustable strap necessary if the nails on strap is in place?

[Erik Johnson]

If you want to do it right:

If your car has the L shaped top saddle brackets, all that is needed for the curtain are the two, black cotton webbing straps with D-rings on one end and footman's loops on the other end.

The two "extra" straps are not factory correct and not needed.

Below is the top on my dad's 1917 touring. He installed it in 1951 using the original for a pattern. This winter, he is actually in the process of re-doing the top.

The D-rings, buckles and footman's loops are original to the car. He had made new cotton webbing straps in 1951 using the originals as patterns (he bought the webbing from a local saddle maker). About five years ago, he gave original hardware to to R.V. Anderson and he made up new straps (R.V. has the correct black webbing, rivets and the metal end-caps).

[R.V.Anderson]

The one man top uses adjustable two piece straps made from black cotton webbing, just like Erik's photo shows. Cotton began to replace leather late in 1914 but leather was still used on some cars well into 1916. By the time of the "black era" rectangular top sockets in 1917 leather top straps were a thing of the past, except on the saddles.

[R.V.Anderson]

TWO-MAN TOP. Good grief.

[Oldav8tor]

RV Anderson makes excellent straps with necessary D rings and etc. He also knows which get leather and which get webbing and what fittings are correct for each year. They work great on my 1917 Touring with a two-man top. Without the straps you put quite a load on the tacks holding the back piece to the rear bow and body tack strips.

[Norman Kling]

The question is: If the two straps are in place, are the adjustable straps still needed? The important thing is to use the footman loop on the bow and the ring on the bracket where the saddle lays when the top is down. The reason is, that when you drive into a head wind, you are adding your speed to the wind speed. So you could get 75 to 100 mph wind against that back part of the top. It could blow out the tacks or rip the material from the tacks. Then the whole top collapses. The leather or web straps securely attached will keep the top from collapsing even if some tacks on the rear curtain come out.

Now I have a question. Some cars I see and some pictures show a snap between the top and each of the two center bows on each side. Others do not have a snap. Is the snap original? I know it will help keep the top from flapping in the wind, but don't know whether it is original.
Norm

[jsaylor]

The late 21 with the new 3 piece rear section didn’t use the D rings but footman loops on the tack strip.

[Emeraude]

In my research looking for photos of touring top I saw many had a large tack attaching the top to the 3 & 4 bow.i asked classtique about this and they said the large tacks have not been available for many years and suggested using a snap

[Original Smith]

I noticed on an above post, the owner hand stitched the bow drill for the bows. Only the top pads are hand stitched.

[Erik Johnson]

Larry:

On a two-man touring top, the bow covering is done as follows:

- First bow: leatherette cut on the bias is tacked onto the bow

- Second and third bow: cotton drill is sewn (you can put tacks through the drill in the areas of the bow that are ultimately covered by the pads, where the pads are also tacked to the bow)

- Fourth bow: cotton drill is tacked onto the bow

The reason for sewing the cotton drill on the second and third bow and not tacked to the bows is that the tack heads would eventually wear through the top material.

[Allan]

I was interested in the discussion because when I tow my tourer over long distances on my open trailer, I fold the top, take it off the car and carry it in the tow vehicle. That means the straps at the back are detachable. Normally on our colonial built bodies the strap is tacked at the back and carries all the way forward to the front bow in ONE piece, effectively binding the whole thing together as a unit. I can see that two man tops might need the extra strap, but our one man tops do quite well with just the one. On Duncan and Fraser standard tourer bodies, they didn't even fit the pads at the sides to help with tying it all together. Perhaps the heavy canvas they used was a more substantial material than the available black top product of the time.

Allan from down under.