Misaligned front wheel, no thread left on tie rod?

[ivaldes1]

Hi all, my front wheels are misaligned: 54 inch at the front of the wheel, 52 inch at the back. The tie rod end doesn't look as though there isn't anymore thread left to further tighten (shorten) the tie rod. Do tie rods come in different or smaller sizes? I don't see any for sale at Lang's.

[Allan]

You need to LENGTHEN the tie rod to reduce the measurement at the front! At least, we do down under.

Allan from down under.

[Allan]

I took a second look, and unless there is some optical illusion, your front spring perches are installed wrong way round and you will have caster leaning forwards rather than back at the top of the king pins.
Others mat see it differently.

Allan from down under.

[Wayne Sheldon]

Are you saying there are 54 inches between the tires at the front of the tire/wheel? And 52 inches at the rear of the tire/wheel?
I think Allen is right!
And about the spring perches also.

[Kerry]

The lathe live centre boss on the perch is facing the rear of the car so to me it looks as it should.

[Jerry VanOoteghem]

The lathe live centre boss on the perch is facing the rear of the car so to me it looks as it should.

Agreed. They look fine.

[Alan Long]

Yep, agree you need to lengthen the rod so the difference is shorter at the front compared to the back by 1/4” or as close
as you can get with the mandatory one turn adjustment. Ie Wheels should “Toe in” (not parallel or toeing out)
Alan in Western Australia

[John kuehn]

The first picture of the spring perche has a shadow that causes the backward effect in my estimation. But looking at the second picture you can see that it is correct.

[Jerry VanOoteghem]

Yep, agree you need to lengthen the rod so the difference is shorter at the front compared to the back by 1/4” or as close
as you can get with the mandatory one turn adjustment. Ie Wheels should “Toe in” (not parallel or toeing out)
Alan in Western Australia

Yes. And, the toe-in should be about 3/16" - 1/4". Some people misinterpret the diagram, showing the camber setting, in the Ford manual as being for the toe-in setting. They then try get a 3" toe-in! A guy in our local chapter did that and used up 2 brand new tires in one tour!

[ivaldes1]

The measurements are in reverse. The front of the wheels are 52 inches wheel to wheel, the rears are 54 so it is pigeon toed. From the drivers seat they are /\ not \/ so I need a shorter tie rod I think. Do tie rods come in different sizes? I think my current one is about a 44 inch.

[Dallas Landers]

2014 forum dicussion

[DanTreace]

Dallas

Those rods in your picture are the 'drag' links or steering gear connecting rods, from pitman arm to the tie rod.

The 'tie' rod that is in question is the spindle connection rod, from spindle to spindle.

All the new paint needs to be removed from that tie rod, clear the cotter, un-due the nut on the ball link, spread the yoke slit and remove ball. Then spread the yoke is now loose to rotate the threaded yoke to set the distance needed, per paragraph #115 in Ford Service.

(Note in vise is the ball end, that was egg shaped from wear and will be replaced, so jaw damage didn't matter)

[DanTreace]

From the drivers seat they are /\ . Do tie rods come in different sizes? I think my current one is about a 44 inch.

Seems you may have it OK, the tires in front need to point slightly at each other to track down the road without wandering.

Tie rods or spindle connecting rods come in two lengths, the early one with brazed non- adj. yoke and the later rod with the threaded adj. yoke that you have.

Check your measure. The Ford way (there are other ways) of setting is to measure from an imaginary center line at the hub, and to take measure from the backside inside rim and the frontside inside rim the tire is mounted on, to the opposite rim, to get the difference.

Adj. measure spring loaded tubular rod, telescopes to fit between the rims, has lock nut, and has marks to note the 1/4" or less difference in proper setting.

[Norman Kling]

Sometimes the wheels are slightly bent or crooked making a measurement from the rim to rim incorrect. I like to place a strip of masking tape on the front center of the tire and scribe a vertical line on it. I can use a large carpenters square to find the center of the tire and also make the line straight vertical. Then I measure the distance between the lines on the front of the tires. Then push the car so the tires make one half turn so the tape is on the back and measure. That way I get exactly the distances of toe out or toe in. It is also possible that one or both the spindle arms is bent which would change the length of toe in. But start out by checking the simplest things first and look for others only if you can't find anything else wrong.
Norm

[TRDxB2]

As many have said the adjustment is backwards. He has 54 at the front and 52 at the back.

Hi all, my front wheels are misaligned: 54 inch at the front of the wheel, 52 inch at the back. The tie rod end doesn't look as though there isn't anymore thread left to further tighten (shorten) the tie rod. Do tie rods come in different or smaller sizes? I don't see any for sale at Lang's.

frnt.png (416.51 KiB) Viewed 4333 times

The perches are correct for that year with the boss to towards the rear of the car.

perch.png (154.26 KiB) Viewed 4333 times

Spindles are designed so the spindle nut does not tighten from the wheel spinning in the direction of travel.Driver side (right hand thread) & passenger side (left hand thread) s: so better check that too
Spindle Arms can't tell for sure from the picture
Driver's side arm #270, Spindle arm - #203-4C, Passenger side arm #282; Spindle #203-4C;
The arms look correct, make sure they bend upward and inward.

[Jerry VanOoteghem]

Ignacio,

Have a close look at your spindle arms. See if they both have the same bend to them, when standing over them and viewing them from the above. A bent arm can use up all of your adjustment.

[Mark Gregush]

The measurements are in reverse. The front of the wheels are 52 inches wheel to wheel, the rears are 54 so it is pigeon toed. From the drivers seat they are /\ not \/ so I need a shorter tie rod I think. Do tie rods come in different sizes? I think my current one is about a 44 inch.

Once you set the proper toe in, you will have plenty of rod thread. The wheels should be /\, narrower to the front. As it is now, you have a 2 inch difference, should only be 3/16-1/4". So the rear of the wheels are now too far apart. Once you pull them together, you will gain thread.

[Norman Kling]

Some of the earlier T's were built 4 inches wider than the standard width, because they would fit in the ruts used by the wagons of those days. I'm not sure whether or not the tie rod was longer or that it would fit on later models. That is the only thing I could think of which could be a different tie rod. Maybe someone else knows more about differences in length of tie rods.
Norm

[Norman Kling]

Some of the earlier T's were built 4 inches wider than the standard width, because they would fit in the ruts used by the wagons of those days. I'm not sure whether or not the tie rod was longer or that it would fit on later models. That is the only thing I could think of which could be a different tie rod. Maybe someone else knows more about differences in length of tie rods.
Norm

[DanTreace]

Do tie rods come in different sizes? I think my current one is about a 44 inch.

No, not the adjustable yoke later style that you have. Unless someone cut it short, that rod should be 47 1/2” from the outside of the fixed yoke flanges to the other threaded bare end , after the adj. yoke is removed.

[ivaldes1]

Here are better pictures. The tie rod looks as though it is adjusted shorter as far as it can go. I manually set the passenger side front wheel to align with the rear and it does. The drivers side is then clearly off. Using the measurement method on the front wheels it is 52 across at the front of the wheels and 54 inches across at the back of the wheels. My conjecture is the tie rod is a bit too long? Solutions?

[Scott_Conger]

Why does it look like simple painted masking tape where the missing threads are/should be??

And, here is someone who was suffering the same exact problem and what he did to solve it: http://www.mtfca.com/discus/messages/41 ... 1411179451

[Henry K. Lee]

Building a car from a hay wagon can cause parts to fit improperly due to cobbling up.., just sayin'. You might want to get a real good measurement from the above post. In car building always completely assemble after parts are rebuilt for fitment then paint. No salt in wounds but been there before too!

Hank

[DanTreace]

Scott sees the same.

Posted earlier :All the new paint needs to be removed from that tie rod ...end


This is what a clean adjustable end should look like for moving the yoke in and out.

[Bill Dizer]

One question, how true are the tires and wheels? When you jack up each wheel and spin it, how much side to side runout is there? If there is much at all, it can sure change the apparent toe on the front end. You need to find the true center of the tire front and rear before you measure toe. You can put a piece of tape on the front and rear of the tire where you can get a straight tape measurement, then Jack the wheel up, and using something like a bucket upside down, a gallon paint can or whatever, hold a pen or marker very still, and rotate the tire so the tape is marked. This will give you the same measurement point front and rear, for an accurate measurement.

[Norman Kling]

From the picture with the white paint on it, it looks like whoever painted it put some masking tape on the threads to keep them from being painted. I think you either have tape there or a layer of very thick paint, because you will notice that for about one inch the paint looks different from the rest of the parts. Try scraping that area and see if you find some more threads there. Remember if the difference between the front and rear is 2 inches, then it will only take one inch adjustment to get it right. You will notice the other posts of tie rods, there is a threaded area inside the yoke and yours seems to end flush with the yoke.
Norm

[TRDxB2]

As you recall it was noted in a previous discussion that youwere warned about premature powder coating. Taping, disassembly etc before chassis parts and powder coating separatelyt. Here is one https://mtfca.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php? ... 64614There is no doubt that the there are more threads under the powder coat as this and the other picture indicate.

I have used this to remove everything - others may have another suggestion

[ivaldes1]

Only a FOOL would think it was masking tape on that. Uh, um, MAskinG TaPE???!!!! I will never live this down.

[TRDxB2]

I just hope there are no more replies to this thread now....

[Henry K. Lee]

We have all had those moments.., just another notch in the pistol grip!

Hank

[TXGOAT2]

Don't goop it up. It always leads to problems.