13mm On a Model T - REALLY?

[Hudson29]

SpeedyT spotted that the grease fitting elbow for the fan on my Frankin T '14 was a clever improvement by a gifted builder and not an original FORD part. It looked so at home and worked so well I assumed that Ford built it that way. Now that the ball bearings in the hub rendered it no more than an ornament I could retain it or go back to original. This car is a mixture of parts so there is no real reason to be original except that it pleases me to return this car to its stock appearance wherever possible so I added a stock dope cup to an order I had with one of the suppliers for another project on the same car.

The part arrived and looked to be well made. It was a bit dull so I polished it so that it would more closely match the fan hub. They can tarnish together & look more at home that way. I grabbed a 1/2" wrench and found it was just a bit too snug to fit the hex on the cup. 9/16 was too large. 13mm fit like a glove and the cup is now installed on the car and looking very proud of itself.

I was not as pleased as the cup was. While truly grateful to have the part available at all, I was a bit peeved to need a metric wrench to install it. The cup threaded onto the shaft as it should, the maker got that SAE thread correct. Why not make the hex an SAE size also? Surely it can't be any cheaper to make it wrong that it would be to make it right?

Then another thought occured to me. I read someplace long ago that in the early days of the industry auto makers made their own threads. Packard for example supposedly had threads on nuts and bolts that no other maker shared. If I remember this correctly, perhaps wrench sizes were the same. This Model T engine dates back to 1908 & was an evolutionary descendent of even earlier engineering. Is it possible that at one time there was a wrench size that fit between a 1/2 & a 9/16?

That certainly seems like a long shot, the repop part is almost certainly just made wrong but I'll bet someone on this list will know the answer.

Paul

[Kerry]

The one between 1/2" and 9/16" wasn't uncommon at one time around the British empire, it was 1/4" Whitworth.

[Craig Leach]

I seem it remember a 17/32 in a wrench set?
Craig

[KBurket]

There are a couple 17/32” open end wrenches advertised on eBay. Craftsman, Bluepoint, EASCo...

[Steve Jelf]

Yes, there were wrenches in 32nd sizes. I have at least one 17/32 open end, and a couple of sockets. But I bet your grease cup is just made wrong.

[Kerry]

I had never heard of or seen a 17/32" spanner, so a google search comes up same as the British 1/4" whitworth.

[Allan]

17/32" is not unheard of here in Australia either. 23/32" is anther. I have no idea of any special application for them.When I discovered my 1/2" drive Waldon Worcester ratcheting socket driver there were two or three ?/32" sockets in the box. They were also listed in their catalog.

Allan from down under.

[Chris Barker]

"The man with a watch always knows what time it is, the man with two watches is never sure"


Being confident is not always the same as being right!

[Hudson29]

I think you have the essence of the saying Chris. Participating in this forum we learn many "truths" and they often contradict each other.

I have been a big fan of British Land Rovers, sports cars & motorbikes all my life. I still have a 1961 Matchless G80CS, a 1966 Triumph Bonneville and a 1972 Norton Commando retro custom. I built the later to resemble something more like a 1952 bike back before they became collectable. With all that activity, I have also collected a lot of British tools.

I can't imagine Ford would have used a British size, but the 17/32 might be a possibility. What wrench (spanner) do those of you who have original cars use on the hex?

Paul

[Scott_Conger]

I do not recall the thread size equivalent, but I periodically do projects where those "odd" sizes come into play and they typically involve square nuts on old hardware, or old square head lag screws. The 17/32 was the one of the two that was most often reached for...

Craftsman sets of open end wrenches typically came with both "odd" sizes up until around 1970 or so. Almost all of my hand tools are Craftsman and date to WWII or earlier and as such are simply a standard in my assortment.

[Mark Gregush]

What seems uncommon now may not have been so back in the day. For example; 21/32" was the size of the Ford Model A rod nut.
Blame the company that contracted to have the parts made, they should have supplied the correct information, no matter where the parts were made.
I too, over the years, have collected some odd 32nd size wrenches (besides the 21/32 socket).

[Hudson29]

We will soon know if a 17/32 wrench will fit. I just ordered one from eBay with 11/32 on the other side. I'll give'r a whirl as soon as the postman delivers this latest prize.

Paul

[Scott_Conger]

It will fit

Loosely

[Mark Gregush]

You could have just used a small Crescent wrench.

[RajoRacer]

More than likely manufactured overseas thus the metric size !

[nicklm]

Just a suggestion, why not take a bit off 3 sides and bring it down to 1/2 inch with a file or wheel. A little finishing you (others) may never know it wasn't 1/2 inch to begin with.
Nick

[Mark Chaffin]

That appears to be our manufactured part. The machined dimension across the flats is 1/2 inch. They are CNC machined. I measured ten samples and they are correct. Compared it to an original and they are identical. When using a 1/2 open end wrench it is a snug fit. Not sure why you are having a problem Paul.

[Hudson29]

Thanks Mark, you had me doubting myself about this so I tried again with the part installed. The 1/2" wrench will NOT slip over the hex. I tried from several angles and found it was the same each time. A 13mm fits it like a glove.

I spread my business around to try to support all of the good suppliers. I want to do my part to keep you, all of you, going so you can support me. This part did not come from you, at least not directly. BTW, David who handles your orders is terrific. He has often helped me puzzle out needs & issues and is a real asset to your business.

Paul

[Dan Hatch]

Question is “ Where was 1/2” wrench made?”

[Hudson29]

Dunno. Its the same one I have been using for years without fit issues.

Paul

[Hudson29]

I just checked and the wrench is a USA made HUSKY. It was part of a set I bought years ago that has given good service with no fit issues.

Paul

[Allan]

This reminds me of a Stahlwille wrench I had some years back. Stahwille is a premium German brand, but I found some open enders which were made as metrics, and then double branded with imperial equivalents. 12mm is not 1/2"!!!!!!!

Allan from down under.

[joe.wal]

Well at least ONE advantage driving a T in Germany
Having a bunch of 13 mm wrenches I had no problems at all to fasten the grease cup bolt ... and tried the inch wrenches first also without success.

[Mark Chaffin]

After checking the internet, it appears there are several of the same being sold. I though we were the only manufacturer. I guess that is not the case. I'm sorry you are having a problem with your oiler Paul. We appreciate your concern and business.

[Scott_Conger]

A sinking boat with 4 passengers and 3 life preservers is a problem; a grease cup slightly over .500" is an observation.

Mark, thanks for continuing the supply of great parts

[Hudson29]

Just to make sure everyone understands, the cup is installed and looks great. Its only functional purpose is to act as a jam nut. I have no issue with using the 13mm wrench. My sole reason for the post was that it seemed odd that a non Ford metric dimension was used on the hex while the Ford used SAE threads were perfect.

Paul

[Hudson29]

That 17/32 wrench arrived today and just as Scott said, it fits but very loosely. So 13mm it is on this part.

paul