Need Help with My Throttle Rod

Discuss all things Model T related.
Forum rules
If you need help logging in, or have question about how something works, use the Support forum located here Support Forum
Complete set of Forum Rules Forum Rules

Topic author
BLB27
Posts: 892
Joined: Thu Jul 23, 2020 9:28 pm
First Name: Bruce
Last Name: Brakke
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1927 coupe
Location: Ames, Iowa

Need Help with My Throttle Rod

Post by BLB27 » Tue Mar 08, 2022 7:52 pm

I am switching from a vaporizer carb to a NH carb on my 1927 coupe. I will need to move the arm on the throttle rod down about 10" to an existing hole on the rod. My problem is how to move the arm. Apparently, there is some type of "pin" holding it in place. However, the "pin" does not go completely thru the rod. I can move the arm slightly. The situation is shown in the attached photos.

I would appreciate any suggestions on how to move the arm.

A separate question: The throttle and spark rods move fine. Do I need to do anything to the steering column before reinstalling it?
Attachments
20220308_134108.jpg
20220308_133501.jpg
20220308_133522.jpg
20220308_133741.jpg
20220308_133911.jpg

User avatar

RajoRacer
Posts: 5172
Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2019 12:18 pm
First Name: Steve
Last Name: Tomaso
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1914 Touring, 1919 Centerdoor, 1924 TT C-Cab Express, 1925 Racer
Location: Longbranch, WA
Board Member Since: 2001

Re: Need Help with My Throttle Rod

Post by RajoRacer » Tue Mar 08, 2022 8:05 pm

That little pin goes clean through ! Begin with a small drill about 2/3 of the way through then punch out with the same sized drift pin as the drill.


Topic author
BLB27
Posts: 892
Joined: Thu Jul 23, 2020 9:28 pm
First Name: Bruce
Last Name: Brakke
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1927 coupe
Location: Ames, Iowa

Re: Need Help with My Throttle Rod

Post by BLB27 » Tue Mar 08, 2022 8:14 pm

As shown in the last photo, I filed the arm to try and find the other end of the pin. I assume I should continue to try to find the end or should I drill from the other end?

User avatar

RajoRacer
Posts: 5172
Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2019 12:18 pm
First Name: Steve
Last Name: Tomaso
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1914 Touring, 1919 Centerdoor, 1924 TT C-Cab Express, 1925 Racer
Location: Longbranch, WA
Board Member Since: 2001

Re: Need Help with My Throttle Rod

Post by RajoRacer » Tue Mar 08, 2022 10:11 pm

Well, if you attempt to drill from the exposed pin head, you might have to "dress" it off or it could prevent you from driving it through. I've done these before and some can be a real bugger to remove. If it won't drive out just step drill it out completely.


Allan
Posts: 6609
Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2019 7:21 pm
First Name: Allan
Last Name: Bennett
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1912 van, 1917 shooting brake, 1929 roadster buckboard, 1924 tourer, 1925 barn find buckboard, 1925 D &F wide body roadster, 1927LHD Tudor sedan.
Location: Gawler, Australia

Re: Need Help with My Throttle Rod

Post by Allan » Tue Mar 08, 2022 10:45 pm

I'd paint the column before installing it. :D Much easier out of the car.
Allan from down under.

User avatar

John.Zibell
Posts: 361
Joined: Mon Jan 07, 2019 9:09 am
First Name: John
Last Name: Zibell
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1926 Tudor
Location: Huntsville, AL

Re: Need Help with My Throttle Rod

Post by John.Zibell » Wed Mar 09, 2022 11:48 am

My question is does your block have the hole for the NH throttle rode to pass through? If not use the conversion kit available. see http://www.modeltford.com/item/6299CL.aspx
1926 Tudor

User avatar

TRDxB2
Posts: 6260
Joined: Tue Jan 08, 2019 4:56 pm
First Name: Frank
Last Name: Brandi
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: Speedsters (1919 w 1926 upgrades), 1926 (Ricardo Head)
Location: Moline IL
Board Member Since: 2018

Re: Need Help with My Throttle Rod

Post by TRDxB2 » Wed Mar 09, 2022 12:10 pm

Before you try to remove the pin you should look into the product that John mentions above. The pin was likely driven in from the end that is exposed, so it should be able to be driven out from the other side. To expose the hidden end and not distort the lever arm, I would sand the position where the end should be. Some WD40 may b needed. Use a punch to try and drive it out from the back end, if that doesn't work, drill it from that end.
Attachments
pinc.png
The past is a great place and I don't want to erase it or to regret it, but I don't want to be its prisoner either.
Mick Jagger


Jerry VanOoteghem
Posts: 4082
Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2019 4:06 pm
First Name: Jerry
Last Name: Van
Location: S.E. Michigan

Re: Need Help with My Throttle Rod

Post by Jerry VanOoteghem » Wed Mar 09, 2022 12:36 pm

I would drive the pin out from the end that shows. First, I'd grind/file the exposed end down to almost flush with the arm. That way, if the pin is peened over a bit, you remove the enlarged peened end, making it easier to drive the pin out. When preparing to drive the pin out, be sure that you have the shaft firmly supported and that you have a good quality pin punch, just a bit smaller in diameter than the pin and with a nice flat end. Just whacking away on the unsupported shaft won't get it done. It will still most likely be very tight and you may ultimately just end up drilling the pin out entirely.

User avatar

Humblej
Posts: 1957
Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2019 12:23 pm
First Name: Jeff
Last Name: Humble
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1926 Canadian coupe, 1924 TT C-cab, 1924 runabout
Location: Charlevoix, Mi
Board Member Since: 2006

Re: Need Help with My Throttle Rod

Post by Humblej » Wed Mar 09, 2022 2:04 pm

Bruce, you can leave the old arm where it is and add a second arm at the other location. You will not have to deal with removing that pin, and you or a future owner will be set up to switch back to a vaporizer if wanted.


Topic author
BLB27
Posts: 892
Joined: Thu Jul 23, 2020 9:28 pm
First Name: Bruce
Last Name: Brakke
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1927 coupe
Location: Ames, Iowa

Re: Need Help with My Throttle Rod

Post by BLB27 » Wed Mar 09, 2022 7:51 pm

John, There is a hole in the block.

User avatar

RajoRacer
Posts: 5172
Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2019 12:18 pm
First Name: Steve
Last Name: Tomaso
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1914 Touring, 1919 Centerdoor, 1924 TT C-Cab Express, 1925 Racer
Location: Longbranch, WA
Board Member Since: 2001

Re: Need Help with My Throttle Rod

Post by RajoRacer » Wed Mar 09, 2022 8:10 pm

There is an accessory bolt-on throttle lead available - another option ?


Topic author
BLB27
Posts: 892
Joined: Thu Jul 23, 2020 9:28 pm
First Name: Bruce
Last Name: Brakke
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1927 coupe
Location: Ames, Iowa

Re: Need Help with My Throttle Rod

Post by BLB27 » Wed Mar 09, 2022 8:26 pm

Where would I get that?


Topic author
BLB27
Posts: 892
Joined: Thu Jul 23, 2020 9:28 pm
First Name: Bruce
Last Name: Brakke
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1927 coupe
Location: Ames, Iowa

Re: Need Help with My Throttle Rod

Post by BLB27 » Wed Mar 09, 2022 8:42 pm

I found it. Page 99 Lang's catalog, 6297. I should have looked before I asked!


Topic author
BLB27
Posts: 892
Joined: Thu Jul 23, 2020 9:28 pm
First Name: Bruce
Last Name: Brakke
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1927 coupe
Location: Ames, Iowa

Re: Need Help with My Throttle Rod

Post by BLB27 » Wed Mar 09, 2022 10:06 pm

The bolt on arm sure looks like the way to go! Thanks, Steve.

As I said in my original post, the spark and throttle arms move fine. Is there anything I should think about replacing on the steering column.


JRSpada4
Posts: 98
Joined: Sun Jan 20, 2019 12:39 pm
First Name: Jim
Last Name: Spadafore
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1925 Touring
Location: Fairmont,WV
Board Member Since: 2016

Re: Need Help with My Throttle Rod

Post by JRSpada4 » Thu Mar 10, 2022 5:10 am

While you’ve got the steering column off, now would be a good time to check the felt and brass bushing in the steering bracket that mounts to the frame.


John Codman
Posts: 1481
Joined: Mon Jan 07, 2019 10:27 am
First Name: John
Last Name: Codman
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1927 Youring
Location: Naples, FL 34120

Re: Need Help with My Throttle Rod

Post by John Codman » Thu Mar 10, 2022 12:56 pm

There's an old saying "If it ain't broke, don't fix it." If everything in the steering column is working OK, I strongly recommend leaving it alone. You can/will open a bag of worms if you take it apart.

User avatar

TRDxB2
Posts: 6260
Joined: Tue Jan 08, 2019 4:56 pm
First Name: Frank
Last Name: Brandi
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: Speedsters (1919 w 1926 upgrades), 1926 (Ricardo Head)
Location: Moline IL
Board Member Since: 2018

Re: Need Help with My Throttle Rod

Post by TRDxB2 » Thu Mar 10, 2022 1:33 pm

BLB27 wrote:
Wed Mar 09, 2022 10:06 pm
The bolt on arm sure looks like the way to go! Thanks, Steve.

As I said in my original post, the spark and throttle arms move fine. Is there anything I should think about replacing on the steering column.
Yes think about doing "NOTHING" else. As the man said, if it ain't broke don't fix it. Taking apart the steering column requires the careful removal of several peened rivets. You already have encountered the easiest to remove. Good advice about checking the steering bracket attached to the frame. You have a '26/7 steering column - if you have the appropriate '26 bracket
Attachments
sb1.png
sb2.png
sb2.png (122.77 KiB) Viewed 3309 times
The past is a great place and I don't want to erase it or to regret it, but I don't want to be its prisoner either.
Mick Jagger


Scott_Conger
Posts: 6523
Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2019 11:18 am
First Name: Scott
Last Name: Conger
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1919
Location: not near anywhere, WY
Board Member Since: 2005

Re: Need Help with My Throttle Rod

Post by Scott_Conger » Thu Mar 10, 2022 1:48 pm

All of these questions are excellent ones to ask PRIOR to removing paint. All they are now are multiple opportunities to pollute bare steel with oils and greases that are very difficult to remove and successfully paint over at this point.

That said, with respect to either suspension or steering components, I find it hard to believe anyone would recommend ignoring 90+ years of wear unless the car was destined to cold storage in the back room of a Museum.
Scott Conger

Tyranny under the guise of law is still Tyranny

NH Full Flow Float Valves™
Obsolete carburetor parts manufactured


Jerry VanOoteghem
Posts: 4082
Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2019 4:06 pm
First Name: Jerry
Last Name: Van
Location: S.E. Michigan

Re: Need Help with My Throttle Rod

Post by Jerry VanOoteghem » Thu Mar 10, 2022 3:43 pm

TRDxB2 wrote:
Thu Mar 10, 2022 1:33 pm
BLB27 wrote:
Wed Mar 09, 2022 10:06 pm
The bolt on arm sure looks like the way to go! Thanks, Steve.

As I said in my original post, the spark and throttle arms move fine. Is there anything I should think about replacing on the steering column.
Yes think about doing "NOTHING" else. As the man said, if it ain't broke don't fix it. Taking apart the steering column requires the careful removal of several peened rivets. You already have encountered the easiest to remove. Good advice about checking the steering bracket attached to the frame. You have a '26/7 steering column - if you have the appropriate '26 bracket
Who said anything about taking the whole steering column apart???

User avatar

TRDxB2
Posts: 6260
Joined: Tue Jan 08, 2019 4:56 pm
First Name: Frank
Last Name: Brandi
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: Speedsters (1919 w 1926 upgrades), 1926 (Ricardo Head)
Location: Moline IL
Board Member Since: 2018

Re: Need Help with My Throttle Rod

Post by TRDxB2 » Thu Mar 10, 2022 3:57 pm

Jerry VanOoteghem wrote:
Thu Mar 10, 2022 3:43 pm
TRDxB2 wrote:
Thu Mar 10, 2022 1:33 pm
BLB27 wrote:
Wed Mar 09, 2022 10:06 pm
The bolt on arm sure looks like the way to go! Thanks, Steve.

As I said in my original post, the spark and throttle arms move fine. Is there anything I should think about replacing on the steering column.
Yes think about doing "NOTHING" else. As the man said, if it ain't broke don't fix it. Taking apart the steering column requires the careful removal of several peened rivets. You already have encountered the easiest to remove. Good advice about checking the steering bracket attached to the frame. You have a '26/7 steering column - if you have the appropriate '26 bracket
Who said anything about taking the whole steering column apart???
Is this what you wanted to know?
by BLB27 » Wed Mar 09, 2022 9:06 pm
The bolt on arm sure looks like the way to go! Thanks, Steve.
As I said in my original post, the spark and throttle arms move fine. Is there anything I should think about replacing on the steering column.
by John Codman » Thu Mar 10, 2022 11:56 am
There's an old saying "If it ain't broke, don't fix it." If everything in the steering column is working OK, I strongly recommend leaving it alone. You can/will open a bag of worms if you take it apart.
The past is a great place and I don't want to erase it or to regret it, but I don't want to be its prisoner either.
Mick Jagger

User avatar

Bill Robinson
Posts: 309
Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2019 2:24 pm
First Name: Bill
Last Name: Robinson
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: '21 Depot Hack, '25 Touring Car, '26 Roadster Pickup, '27 Tudor, & another '27 Tudor
Location: Salty Bottom, ALABAMA AL
Board Member Since: 1999
Contact:

Re: Need Help with My Throttle Rod

Post by Bill Robinson » Thu Mar 10, 2022 4:11 pm

Rather than take the column apart to check the bushing, why not try this.....while under the car push up and down on the pitman arm or steering shaft (if the pitman arm has been removed). carefully watch for any slop at the bushing.
I suggest this because I fought with a "wandering" model T by rebuilding the front axle and still losing. I finally checked and replaced the bushing and the "wandering" went away. Life would have been much easier if I had started there first. :lol:


speedytinc
Posts: 4725
Joined: Fri Feb 12, 2021 12:24 pm
First Name: john
Last Name: karvaly
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 14/15 wide track roadster. 23 touring, 27 roadster pickup, 20ish rajo touring
Location: orange, ca
Board Member Since: 2020

Re: Need Help with My Throttle Rod

Post by speedytinc » Thu Mar 10, 2022 4:43 pm

Bill Robinson wrote:
Thu Mar 10, 2022 4:11 pm
Rather than take the column apart to check the bushing, why not try this.....while under the car push up and down on the pitman arm or steering shaft (if the pitman arm has been removed). carefully watch for any slop at the bushing.
I suggest this because I fought with a "wandering" model T by rebuilding the front axle and still losing. I finally checked and replaced the bushing and the "wandering" went away. Life would have been much easier if I had started there first. :lol:
During our annual inspection "tours", Steering bushing wear is the first thing checked. Its as simple as having someone look down on the bracket whall another person moves the steering wheel back & forth watching for the slop in the shaft. The problem can be in the stability of the mount and/or the bushing fit.The visual inspection continues down thru the pitman arm, steering connection, tie rod & spindle arms.
A freshly rebuilt steering/front end makes for a great drive. Too many people overlook the steering bracket or piece meal the repairs & still complain about the driveability of their T.


Jerry VanOoteghem
Posts: 4082
Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2019 4:06 pm
First Name: Jerry
Last Name: Van
Location: S.E. Michigan

Re: Need Help with My Throttle Rod

Post by Jerry VanOoteghem » Thu Mar 10, 2022 7:50 pm

TRDxB2 wrote:
Thu Mar 10, 2022 3:57 pm
Jerry VanOoteghem wrote:
Thu Mar 10, 2022 3:43 pm
TRDxB2 wrote:
Thu Mar 10, 2022 1:33 pm

Yes think about doing "NOTHING" else. As the man said, if it ain't broke don't fix it. Taking apart the steering column requires the careful removal of several peened rivets. You already have encountered the easiest to remove. Good advice about checking the steering bracket attached to the frame. You have a '26/7 steering column - if you have the appropriate '26 bracket
Who said anything about taking the whole steering column apart???
Is this what you wanted to know?
by BLB27 » Wed Mar 09, 2022 9:06 pm
The bolt on arm sure looks like the way to go! Thanks, Steve.
As I said in my original post, the spark and throttle arms move fine. Is there anything I should think about replacing on the steering column.
by John Codman » Thu Mar 10, 2022 11:56 am
There's an old saying "If it ain't broke, don't fix it." If everything in the steering column is working OK, I strongly recommend leaving it alone. You can/will open a bag of worms if you take it apart.

I read that already. He doesn't mention completely disassembling the whole column, and neither does anyone else.

Post Reply Previous topicNext topic