Stan Howe Estate Auction #2

[Bryce S.]

I just went and checked online and it seems that they have posted the next auction.

https://www.pateauction.com/auctions/detail/bw84088

-Bryce

[Bryce S.]

Stan had quite a impressive collection of carbs. Many T parts in this one.

[Mark Osterman]

As they say … you can’t take it with you. Sell or give away what you don’t need to someone younger who’s eager to get a hold of hard to find parts while you’re still above ground.

[Henry K. Lee]

Yep..., Only the auction company and IRS will benefit at an auction!

Hank

[jiminbartow]

Did anyone have their carb in Stan’s shop for repair at the time he suddenly passed away? If so, how would they go about getting it returned to them? Jim Patrick

[Alan Long]

Jim, in the early days just after Stan’s death there was a posting on this Forum asking that exact question. The poster was
working with the family. My friend had his 5 Ball off his 1910 with Stan and had also paid a considerable deposit ($500)?
The carby was returned back to Australia for which he was very grateful for but I haven’t asked if the $’s has been refunded.
Alan In Western Australia

[RajoRacer]

I'm in contact with Stan's nephew - after the auctions, estate & the dust settles, if there are funds available, people who were contacted having deposits paid, perhaps will see a refund or partial refund - that's what was relayed to me.

[Aussie16]

I have a friend that paid in full for a carb that Stan had in stock which was promised to be rebuilt and sent out. Despite a full email trail of the transaction and job, my friend to this point has yet to receive a rebuilt carb or a refund. I hope that the proceeds of the estate sale are able to be dispersed to any transactions that are still outstanding.

[Henry K. Lee]

I have to honestly say.., whether you are a hobbyist or business...., safety, protection, control logging in and out of the clients item sent to you are most of importance. Why would anyone require a deposit for repair of a valuable item, we all bill out monthly statements when the repair process begins. Put people on a timeline of notification of when to send you the item, not just send it and I will get on it in three years.

Absolutely NO DISRESPECT TO UNCLE STAN, but this is not a good business or hobby practice period. Way to many red flags. I, in the past as many of you know doing items for others, only offer services with no delays. Please use this as a tool.

RIP Stan!

Hank

[RGould1910]

Absolutely agree!

[RajoRacer]

I concur Hank - after 30 + years in the Model T repair, service & parts business I never required a deposit unless a "big ticket" item such as outsourced Babbitt work or tires were in order. I knew Stan for better than 40 years and considered him a friend but his business practices were sometimes questionable.

[ThreePedalTapDancer]

Stan did it because he was burned multiple times by guys who would send carbs and wouldnt pay. He used to do it on a handshake, but unfortunately there’s a lot of flakes out there. They seem to think just because it’s for a T it should be T era prices. Anyway, he used to have a month or so turnaround, but in the end he got over his head and just couldn’t catch up. He did several carbs for me in the past, and they were top notch.

[jiminbartow]

Always, before leaving a valuable part for repair with a vendor, I take several high definition pictures of all sides of the part concentrating on distinctive features, such as dents or casting defects and serial numbers, in case there is a miscommunication, or a situation like this. If anyone here is out a carburetor and has such pictures and communications in the form of letters, e-mails and cancelled checks, hopefully you can prove ownership before the items are auctioned. If there is a catalog of items being auctioned off with pictures of the items, compare your pictures with the items being auctioned. If you see your item, contact the auctioneer and put a hold on the item. If there were previous auctions and catalogs, do the same. I believe Stan was an auctioneer and it may be his company that is handling the auction. Jim Patrick

[Harry Lillo]

I was involved in connecting many of the carb owners with their carbs through this great MTFCA Forum. Stan's family spent weeks getting the carbs back to their rightful owners.

Steve is right; no one will be refunded their deposits until the estate is settled and all creditors including those with outstanding carb deposits are satisfied. This will take some additional time, most likely after the last auction.

Stan always had a saying when he found something unusual at a swap meet or auction " You will likely find this in my estate sale". Truer words were never spoken and now here we are.

Stan worked hard at his carb business and helped many people get their cars running properly by rebuilding their carbs or explaining how to repair theirs over the phone.

He was an honest man and I am not sure this should be the format for questioning his integrity?

[KWTownsend]

I bought a Stromberg OF on T-bay and had the seller send it directly to Stan for rebuild. Stan said it was one of the nicest ones he had ever seen and got started on it. I think he must have worked on OFs in "batches." Anyway, after seeing Harry's post about Stan's passing I contacted the family. When I heard back from them, they sent me a photo of a stripped down Stromberg OF, body only, that had my name and date on it.

I told them it was a complete, beautiful carburetor. They said, "This is what we have." I contacted the seller and asked him if he had any photos from when he listed it, but he did not. I even looked at my past e-bay purchases, etc. to no avail. Oh well, some sometimes you win, sometimes you loose.

: ^ (

Keith

[jiminbartow]

Harry. Everyone on this forum respected Stan and knew he was a man of impeccable integrity. He often said he was excepting no more business because he was so busy. It is easy to imagine that, in being so overwhelmed, Stan’s shop would have been full of carburetors in various states of repair and it is safe to assume that the majority of carburetors and parts on his work bench, at the time of his passing, belonged to customers that submitted them for repair. Naturally, there are going to be customers out there that never received their repaired carburetor. I was simply suggesting ways for MTFCA members to retrieve their carburetors and thought there would be a no better medium than the Forum to inquire. The forum that was frequented by Stan and his customers. Thank you for you efforts in attempting to remedy this unfortunate situation. If my questions and suggestions came off as questioning Stan’s integrity, I sincerely apologize. Jim Patrick

[Scott_Conger]

With so many smalls, a third party shipping company could make a bunch of $$ working this auction. I'd pay a crazy price to bid-to-win, sight-unseen, and then pay for packing on a good number of lots, if I knew I wasn't having to invest 550 miles of driving to pick up just 1 or two small boxes of parts. Honestly, as it is, if I wanted 5 lots and only got only one, it would be cheaper to pay for it and abandon it in place than to pick it up. Given that fact, after waiting anxiously for months to see this auction, knowing now that any given carb has its parts spread throughout a dozen boxes/lots, one would have to go 1 day to preview and return another day to pick up, and the costs associated with two round trips, well, there's only one choice for me. If it was an on-site auction it would involve only one trip and I'd be there with bells on and take my chances that it paid off.

Local fellows will do very well, and good luck to them

I wish all the best to Stan's family and the friends who have worked so hard to help them through a difficult time.

[jiminbartow]

Stan was recognized as the foremost carburetor expert. It is an unfortunate fact that complete carburetors will bring much more money than a bunch of miscellaneous parts. I doubt if there is anyone here that knows as much about carburetors as Stan, but if there is and you know about the various Model T carburetors and you live close to where the auction will be held, it would be an immense help to Stan’s estate and his family if you could contact the auctioneer and offer your services to go through the multitude of boxes containing carburetor parts in an attempt to reunite the parts into complete carburetors. I would wager that, were he able to make his wishes known, Stan would welcome this effort so the completed carburetors would bring more money for his family and make his customers whole. Good luck. Jim Patrick

PS. If I’m not mistaken, there are explosive view drawings of a wide variety of carburetors that will help in this endeavor.

[Scott_Conger]

Jim, I understand your sentiment, but the it seems to me that the only surprise about death is perhaps it's timing...not if it will occur. That said, honestly, if there ever was a concern about selling complete carbs at auction, they never would have been disassembled in the first place. That was the inventory system in place in that shop. It is not the system in place in mine.

My shop has tons of carbs and other things all identified. All tooling is metal stamped as to what it's use is for so that their obscure use may be identified and if found to be valuable by someone, could be purchased. Tooling for each lathe is identified and stored with the respective lathe. Drills, reamers, taps, dies are in indexes and are sharp, with those needing remediation residing in a specific spot and labeled as "dull". No one attending my Estate Sale will be surprised with what they buy...items will be organized and excellent condition (unless labled "dull"!...at least they'll still be organized!). So fair warning: Be sure to attend my Estate Sale when it occurs.

I have dozens of floats, covers, throttles, etc., and everyone of them is easily identified since they still reside in the carb that they were built with when new.

Organization takes a conscious effort, which is not everyone's cup of tea. Adequate time, desire, state of mind and good health all play into it as well. I don't think more or less of a person based on their comfort zone or tastes in how they conduct themselves, so to readers, please do not misconstrue my comments as being either positive or negative. They just "are". The state of an Estate Sale is purely a reflection of how the owner consciously decided to leave things. Nothing more, nothing less.

As for myself, I wish I'd known Stan better than I did. We had met several times, and emailed each other periodically. I am the better for it.

[Jerry VanOoteghem]

Stan was recognized as the foremost carburetor expert. It is an unfortunate fact that complete carburetors will bring much more money than a bunch of miscellaneous parts. I doubt if there is anyone here that knows as much about carburetors as Stan, but if there is and you know about the various Model T carburetors and you live close to where the auction will be held, it would be an immense help to Stan’s estate and his family if you could contact the auctioneer and offer your services to go through the multitude of boxes containing carburetor parts in an attempt to reunite the parts into complete carburetors. I would wager that, were he able to make his wishes known, Stan would welcome this effort so the completed carburetors would bring more money for his family and make his customers whole. Good luck. Jim Patrick

PS. If I’m not mistaken, there are explosive view drawings of a wide variety of carburetors that will help in this endeavor.

Jim,

The unfortunate reality is, that most likely, a lot of those disassembled carbs, or parts of same, belong to someone else, namely Stan's customers.

[Steve Jelf]

The state of an Estate Sale is purely a reflection of how the owner consciously decided to leave things.

"One of these days I'll get all this stuff organized."

[jiminbartow]

From September 2021 to the present, I have thinned out my estate by selling 200 items (antiques, curios, collectibles, the red ‘26 Model T Fordor and Model T parts) on eBay for around $50,000.00 making a nice profit over what I bought the items for during the last 40 years. I may live another 20 years, but if I don’t, my wife and son will benefit from the sales and not have to sell the items in an estate sale for pennies on the dollar. When I totally recover from a recent hand accident I had in April and a hernia operation that is scheduled for September 8, I plan on selling my 1926 coupe, in the next several months. Jim Patrick

[George House]

That’s exactly my reasoning and what I’m doing too Jim.

[Scott_Conger]

Jim and George

that's one way to do it
another is to simply have things in order, have a responsible person know where the paperwork is and be done with it

My dad's 92 and a widower. He has done what I described above and drives and enjoys his 2 Ts on a daily basis. I am nearly certain that if he had sold his stuff off years ago and sat alone in a chair staring at an empty garage and reminiscing about the things which are now only empty spots on shelves, he would have given up 20 years ago

whatever works for you.

[George House]

Oh, I’m not considering dispersal. Jim probably isn’t either. I’ve sold 4 Model T s in the last several years and am now down to 5 Model T s. Hopefully, in 20 years when I’m your dad’s age, I’ll still be cranking on the ‘14. Probly still have the ‘19 centerdoor. But I’m not organized enough or have any responsible friends to get any value out of several tractor trailer loads of Model T parts when I check out.

[Jim, Sr.]

From September 2021 to the present, I have thinned out my estate by selling 200 items (antiques, curios, collectibles, the red ‘26 Model T Fordor and Model T parts) on eBay for around $50,000.00 making a nice profit over what I bought the items for during the last 40 years. I may live another 20 years, but if I don’t, my wife and son will benefit from the sales and not have to sell the items in an estate sale for pennies on the dollar. When I totally recover from a recent hand accident I had in April and a hernia operation that is scheduled for September 8, I plan on selling my 1926 coupe, in the next several months. Jim Patrick

Jim,Are you required to pay any capitol gains on any of the sales?

[Michael Peternell]

I just went and checked online and it seems that they have posted the next auction.

https://www.pateauction.com/auctions/detail/bw84088

-Bryce

I checked this out and can't actually find the auction listing. A few pics but not what is all on the auction. If I remember right from first auction postings the third one was supposed to have most of the model t parts?

[jiminbartow]

Jim, Sr..
Yes. The law went into effect beginning in January, 2022, so anything sold in 2022 will be taxed. Luckily, the majority of my items were sold in 2021. Jim Patrick

[Scott_Conger]

Jim

the original question was regarding Capital Gains...not the tax collected or 1099k which eBay or PayPal issue. Since forever, hobbyists' were to keep basis records, sales records of subsequent sales and log those gains as either short-term or long-term gains. Past a certain threshold, those values were then balanced against your overall income from all sources and depending on your total income, those gains were taxed at the rate determined by an individual's situation.

Now, everyone here has always maintained records of every purchase, every sale, and reported the income generated, right?

Depending on a person's overall income, the act of selling a few cars that have been owned for a long time can generate serious gains. Whether or not those sales are reported, well...most everyone I've encountered in the hobby has been honest with me...with the IRS, probably not so much.