Rims out of true by 1/8 of an inch

[Mustang1964s]

The Title says it all.
I am working on getting the steering in shape. Was about to check the toe in and found out that both the front rims are about or just under 1/8 inch our of true.
Should I be concerned about this?
I don't see how to get the rims trued and at lost how to fix it.

Thank you in advance.

[Allan]

The runout may be improved by careful mounting of the rim if it is demountable. Jack the wheel up and loosen off the lug bolts and free the rim up on the wheel. place a brick or heavy block on the floor and rotate the wheel as you retension the lug bolts. The rim should bind on the steel felloe as the bolts are tightened. Selectively tightening the bolts gives you some control over how well the rims run on the wheels. That said, 1/8" runout is hardly worth fritzing about.

Allan from down under.

[Dan Hatch]

You don’t say what size wheels these are.
If 30x3.5 demountable, there are many different manufacturers. Most rims will not interchange.
That may be part of your problem.

[Mark Gregush]

I agree with Allan, an 1/8 is hardly anything esp at the speeds most people drive at.

[Oldav8tor]

Look at other cars going down the road.....I seldom see one that doesn't have a little wiggle to it. i/8th inch is nothing to worry about.

[Mustang1964s]

I am such a DA sometimes.

I running a '27 touring with wire rims.

[speedytinc]

Even easier.
They can be straightened in a press.
My press wont fit the wheel with the tire on, but I found it real easy to get the wobble to .032" or less with patience.

[Dan Hatch]

Well, that is different.
One old school way to test wire wheels was to remove tire. Roll bare wheel across a flat flor and see if it rolls true.

[speedytinc]

Put the wheel on a front hub & spin it. Use a block to mark the outside wobble. Slowly spin watching the gap grow.
Mark the extreme high & low spots. That will indicate where on the hub to press.

[Jerry VanOoteghem]

An 1/8" is nothing to bother over. Just do some careful inspection of the wheel hubs and the wire wheel centers to be certain no cracking has begun.

[Original Smith]

If you have non demountable wheels, there isn't much you can do.

[TRDxB2]

The Title says it all.
I am working on getting the steering in shape. Was about to check the toe in and found out that both the front rims are about or just under 1/8 inch our of true.
Should I be concerned about this?
I don't see how to get the rims trued and at lost how to fix it.

Thank you in advance.

While your focused on the rim, perhaps you should start looking at the hub as well.

[John kuehn]

As far as the rim goes you’re not going to your run T fast enough to make any difference. You have to remember Model T’s weren’t built like a Rolls Royce or to high standards as other high end makes were.
If it doesn’t shimmy or wobble your OK. I would remove the front rims with the tires and watch the wheel itself when you spin it fairly fast. By doing that you can see a slight wobble in the wheel and hub itself. Other than that don’t worry about it.

[Allan]

A mate of mine in Spokane made a stand for painting wire wheels. He fitted a front hub at the top so he could rotate the rims as he painted. The stand had a dual purpose. He could use a hydraulic jack and a piece of pipe, fitted between the base of the stand and the rim, to persuade bent wheels back into shape.

Allan from down under.

[TXGOAT2]

The straighter you can get them, the better. Perfect is good enough. Wheel runout sets up strains and forces that degrade ride and handling, contributes to tire and suspension parts wear, and may contribute to loosening wood wheels. It also consumes horsepower that would be better used moving the car rather than shaking it.

[Jerry VanOoteghem]

The straighter you can get them, the better. Perfect is good enough. Wheel runout sets up strains and forces that degrade ride and handling, contributes to tire and suspension parts wear, and may contribute to loosening wood wheels. It also consumes horsepower that would be better used moving the car rather than shaking it.

In theory ...
In practice you'll never notice any differences with 1/8" wobble.

[dobro1956]

I remember reading in some Ford literature, probably the Service Bulletin's that factory run out was 3/8 inch when new. Not sure if that was at the wheel rim or tire OD. 1/8 of a inch is actually pretty good.

[TXGOAT2]

Zero is best.

[speedytinc]

I remember reading in some Ford literature, probably the Service Bulletin's that factory run out was 3/8 inch when new. Not sure if that was at the wheel rim or tire OD. 1/8 of a inch is actually pretty good.

I find that hard to believe. I would like to see that bulletin.

[Bill Robinson]

This has worked for me! And it's easy.

How to test it for "true-ness": Jack up a front wheel, support the car. Get a jack stand (or cement block, wood, whatever) and place it next to the rim. Clip a hose, pencil, whatever to the stand so the tip touches the rim (the actual rim, this not ghetto slang here). Rotate the wheel and adjust the pointer so it just touches the highest point of the wobble. This will show you where it's bent, and how far.

How to fix it: You need a torch. I use an acetylene with a small tip. Locate the "low spot" where the pointer is furthest from the rim. Pick an outside spoke and heat about 1" of it. Let it cool naturally. You will watch the rim move towards the pointer as it cools. Physics 101 - metal shrinks as it cools. Repeat until it run's perfectly true. If you go too far, heat an inside spoke to pull it back.

[Mustang1964s]

I'm getting everything tightened up from the wheel down.
My attention turned to the toe-in.
The wooden box that I use as a seat was used to hold a small length of wood about 1/2 x 1 x 24 inches.
Set the edge of the wood to the outer edge of the rim. It's not down to the n'th degree but close.
Rotated the wheel and let it push the wood edge out till it just touched the outer most spots.
Then I used a set filler gage and stacked them till I go a good idea of how far out it was.

The checking of how true the hub is running; this will be checked this week. Might use the micrometer if the gross measurement doesn't yield any results.

[Mustang1964s]

The micrometer was pulled out and set up.
The run out on the passenger side is .018. So I am thinking this is ok.
To measure the kingpin movement, I lifted the hub and the kingpin movement is about .037. That is at the edge of the hub. I know the angle could make it measure high. I am thinking that this is ok as well.

[speedytinc]

Sure you got the decimal point in the right spot? .018" is a long way from 1/8".
.018 would be barely if not not noticeable.

[ewdysar]

Hey Steve.

After seeing the terms like "wobble" and "true-ness" mentioned, can you clarify what kind of runout you are seeing/measuring?

Axial runout (measured parallel to the axle) will show up as the rim or tread moving side to side relative to the hub while spinning the wheel. I believe that axial runout is more common with T wheels and small amounts of axial runout at the rim are probably to be expected after 100 years.

Radial runout (measured perpendicular to the axle) would show up as the rim or tire surface moving closer/farther away from the bearing axis while spinning. Radial runout would be a bigger concern to me and one can probably feel small amounts of radial runout as a "rough ride" while driving.

Keep crankin',
Eric

[Jerry VanOoteghem]

To measure the kingpin movement, I lifted the hub and the kingpin movement is about .037. That is at the edge of the hub.

Measuring at the edge of the hub does not tell you what the kingpin movement is, since there is also clearance in the Timken bearings coming into play. For the record, the kingpin should not move at all. So, "kingpin movement" should be zero, (but often times it is not). I think you're probably looking for wear/movement between the kingpin and the spindle bushings. First, confirm whether the kingpin is actually moving, then determine how much the spindle is moving at its top & bottom ends, due to spindle bushing wear.

[Allan]

You can take any kingpin wear out of the equation by driving a wooden wedge between the spindle body and the yoke in the axle. Then you can get a real feel for any play in the bearings. I like to feel a smidgeon of play. That way I know the bearings are not binding. Then you have things set up to measure just the runout in the wheel/rim/tyre assembly is rotated.

Allan from down under.